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Davy

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Armed Forces Scab force?


BIG G
No one whose house was on fire complained that the army in their green goddesses turned up at their door during the last fire brigade strike. I doubt if someone turns up to hospital in an ambulance driven by the army or is resusciitated by an army medic will be calling them scabs,. The army do not want to be doing jobs that are not part of their remit but they do not have the luxury of striking. The public do not want the army to be used for civilian purposes but accept that they may be the only bridge between chaos and order, life and death. The problem is not with a scab army, but with the leaders of the country and unions who negotiate together, it is they who need to come together and sort out pay and conditions. The army involvement might be seen by some short sighted people as prolonging these talks, but frankly the idea that the country simply be allowed to fall to it's knees whilst unions and politicians get their act together is not a viable alternative.
 
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Davy

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Liverpool dockers on strike Have just won themselves a rise of between 14.3 and 18.5%.Victory to the Dockers!
I am all for fair pay, I hope that all pay rises are affordable and help the workers without causing firms to crash. Also percentage rises are not always the best way, 10% of 200 quid is an extra 20, 10% of 500 is an extra 50, Some are always more equal than others
 

moathibby

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Funnily enough I do remember the last firemen strike,I remember how useless the green godesses were and I remember firemen coming off the picket line to put out fires.
 

moathibby

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If firm can't pay decent pay rates it doesn't deserve to exist.
 

paigntonhibby

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I am all for fair pay, I hope that all pay rises are affordable and help the workers without causing firms to crash. Also percentage rises are not always the best way, 10% of 200 quid is an extra 20, 10% of 500 is an extra 50, Some are always more equal than others
I remember back in the mid seventies I was working in a small engineering firm in Sighthill and the union wanted a larger % for skilled workers than for unskilled, I argued that if they fought for the same % for everybody the skilled would still get a bigger pay rise than the unskilled. I was ignored, put me off unions.
 

paigntonhibby

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Armed Forces Scab force?


BIG G
The armed forces aren't a scab force, they can't strike and they don't want to be covering civilian jobs but if your house caught fire you widnae care what fuckin colour the fire engine was. Its the govt and unions you should be slagging off not the armed forces
 

Davy

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Funnily enough I do remember the last firemen strike,I remember how useless the green godesses were and I remember firemen coming off the picket line to put out fires.
Well someone who may have been saved from a fire may have a different opinion. No one said they were the best firefighter! They were not trained for that, they had inferior outdated equipment..rather like Russian conscripts. But they did what they could, unlike people who sit at a keyboard criticising every bit of good someone tries to do. Perhaps you think it would have been better if no one tried to put the fires out? That the fire brigade came out of the picket line to help in emergencies is credit to them. Just hope for your sake when the nurses go on strike and if you take unwell that there is someone to care for you, army or NHS
 

Davy

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I remember back in the mid seventies I was working in a small engineering firm in Sighthill and the union wanted a larger % for skilled workers than for unskilled, I argued that if they fought for the same % for everybody the skilled would still get a bigger pay rise than the unskilled. I was ignored, put me off unions.
And now the Royal mail want to stop working on Saturdays. The unions are threatening strike action. The Royal mail say they lost £219m over the last 6 months yet the best the union can come up with is a strike, which if it goes ahead incurs further losses and companies will seek out private firms to deliver mail increasing the losses. The there def won't be Saturday mail and for sure no overtime and possibly a reduced workforce. Striking cannot be seen as the only possible course of action in ever pay demand situation and unions would do well who work with firms to look at figures and come up with solution. Bosses and owners who are overpaid or allowed to cream profits is more a government issue
 

HenryLB

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Well if they dont exist they dont produce etc
Sorry, yes I get you now. Quite so.

A lawyer I know became angry with me when I told her my small, 8-person firm would fold if we had more than two people on maternity leave. I didn't make this argument to protest having to hire women, but because it was factual and thus unreasonable to expect us to behave like a 250-head count law firm when we recruited, unless there was some government help for us.

She simply replied that we shouldn't be in business. Which was pretty funny because how would any firm ever get started? It's easy to say businesses "shouldn't exist" but eventually you're going to have to do without a lot of wages and, as you point out, a lot of stuff.
 

Davy

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If firm can't pay decent pay rates it doesn't deserve to exist.
Every firm has to mert rising costs of which wages is one of them. Perhaps that is why USA dont do minimum wages and conditions. Strinking makes little sense in most cases. Didnt do the miners much good in the 80s did it? How many people worked for the coal board in the next 20 years?
 
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hibbybilly

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And now the Royal mail want to stop working on Saturdays. The unions are threatening strike action. The Royal mail say they lost £219m over the last 6 months yet the best the union can come up with is a strike, which if it goes ahead incurs further losses and companies will seek out private firms to deliver mail increasing the losses. The there def won't be Saturday mail and for sure no overtime and possibly a reduced workforce. Striking cannot be seen as the only possible course of action in ever pay demand situation and unions would do well who work with firms to look at figures and come up with solution. Bosses and owners who are overpaid or allowed to cream profits is more a government issue
And if the firms won’t talk with the unions?
 

GORDONSMITH7

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No one whose house was on fire complained that the army in their green goddesses turned up at their door during the last fire brigade strike. I doubt if someone turns up to hospital in an ambulance driven by the army or is resusciitated by an army medic will be calling them scabs,. The army do not want to be doing jobs that are not part of their remit but they do not have the luxury of striking. The public do not want the army to be used for civilian purposes but accept that they may be the only bridge between chaos and order, life and death. The problem is not with a scab army, but with the leaders of the country and unions who negotiate together, it is they who need to come together and sort out pay and conditions. The army involvement might be seen by some short sighted people as prolonging these talks, but frankly the idea that the country simply be allowed to fall to it's knees whilst unions and politicians get their act together is not a viable alternative.
The armed forces aren't a scab force, they can't strike and they don't want to be covering civilian jobs but if your house caught fire you widnae care what fuckin colour the fire engine was. Its the govt and unions you should be slagging off not the armed forces
Same old trope about the Firemans Strike in 1977. I notice that neither you nor Davy mention the proposed scabbing by Military in the Border Force dispute in the here and now.

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BIG G
 

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