"Tories To Offer Scotland Something Big Next Week"

[Smurf]

So says Andrew Neil who generally knows such things. I'd imagine they'll offer Full Fiscal Autonomy or full Home Rule?

As I head to bed I now expect to wake up to the not predicted at all Tory Government with an overall MAJORITY. To have that in the UK with a SNP LANDSLIDE in Scotland isn't sustainable.

The Union in its current formation is dead that's for sure.

 

[greencol]

The union died the day after the referendum.

The corpse has been rotting since.

Time to bury it.

 

[broonieboy]

So says Andrew Neil who generally knows such things. I'd imagine they'll offer Full Fiscal Autonomy or full Home Rule?

As I head to bed I now expect to wake up to the not predicted at all Tory Government with an overall MAJORITY. To have that in the UK with a SNP LANDSLIDE in Scotland isn't sustainable.

The Union in its current formation is dead that's for sure.

Good,it's been a corpse for a long time. If Westminster had seen reform away from FPTP and a more federalised UK, folk might not have got to where they are now.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[SG7nil]

Bottom line is that regardless of how Scotland voted yesterday there was nothing we could do ultimately to deny Cameron a majority. 55 or 56 labour MPs extra still wouldn't have made a difference. Now we look like having a Tory government with free rein to do as they please. This could hasten another referendum!

 

[Greenmachine]

Bottom line is that regardless of how Scotland voted yesterday there was nothing we could do ultimately to deny Cameron a majority. 55 or 56 labour MPs extra still wouldn't have made a difference. Now we look like having a Tory government with free rein to do as they please. This could hasten another referendum!

Possibly, but I doubt it....IMO the SNP will not want go for another independence referendum until they know they will win it...basically until such time as popular opinion in Scotland supports Scotland being independent. Many people in Scotland voted SNP in this election not because they necessarily support independence, but because they feel the SNP will best represent Scotland's interests at Westminster. I do however believe that support for independence will continue to grow in Scotland and as I said after the referendum, this cannot be stopped now and IMO Scotland will eventually become an independent nation. I just think that it will be quite a number of years yet before it happens.

 

[gun ainm]

listening to Struan Stevenson (tory cnt) on the tv they'll offer feck all - a newly emboldened majority conservative party is not likely to come over all conciliatory/progressive. If they do offer something Nicola better check the small print because it will be in their interests not Scotland's

 

[southfieldhibby]

Why would a party with an absolute majority offer anything?

England defeat Labour all by themselves and Scotland won't matter at all.

 

[The__Proclaimer]

Bottom line is that regardless of how Scotland voted yesterday there was nothing we could do ultimately to deny Cameron a majority. 55 or 56 labour MPs extra still wouldn't have made a difference. Now we look like having a Tory government with free rein to do as they please. This could hasten another referendum!

Not really. English turned from lib dem to Tory and bottled out of voting ukip on the back of fear of a party who doesn't want your country to exist getting positions of power in government.

Ironically after claiming to be on the end of it last year, it's fear mongering that's helped given snp their best ever result.

 

[aggie]

Not really. English turned from lib dem to Tory and bottled out of voting ukip on the back of fear of a party who doesn't want your country to exist getting positions of power in government.

Ironically after claiming to be on the end of it last year, it's fear mongering that's helped given snp their best ever result.

Still with this, Proc? Under your analysis, Tories used Scottish voters as the bogeyman. Labour joined in with them by embracing austerity and rejecting a pact with the SNP.

Labour did it to themselves. Dinnae blame us.

 

[The__Proclaimer]

Still with this, Proc? Under your analysis, Tories used Scottish voters as the bogeyman. Labour joined in with them by embracing austerity and rejecting a pact with the SNP.

Labour did it to themselves. Dinnae blame us.

Have you not seen an English edition of a newspaper front page the past month? It's not analysis it's fact.

This was a more left wing Labour than Blair's. Yet where was the nationalist Red Tory backlash in 1997, 2001, 2005? You've (collective use) converted your beliefs when times are hard to nationalism. I personally find that distasteful.

 

[egb_hibs]

Have you not seen an English edition of a newspaper front page the past month? It's not analysis it's fact.

This was a more left wing Labour than Blair's. Yet where was the nationalist Red Tory backlash in 1997, 2001, 2005? You've (collective use) converted your beliefs when times are hard to nationalism. I personally find that distasteful.

i have sympathy with the way you've held your corner in the face of nat belligerence on here. But the obvious riposte here is that labour have absolutely trashed this country, destroyed confidence in the poltical system, been absolutely wicked in their willingness to use mass migration to divide the english working class and buy votes while storing up heaven knows what for the future, treated scorland like an obedient servant, introduced poisonous US style culture war politics, smashed pensions and priced younger people out homes for the envisagable future, lied their way into major wars, are led by people who clearly think much of the demographic the party was formed for a Neanderthal bigots, have unleashed every vindictive censorious inquisitorial instinct in the british population with banning, no platforming, silencing now a feature of british life....

That is distasteful.

 

[Dub]

i have sympathy with the way you've held your corner in the face of nat belligerence on here. But the obvious riposte here is that labour have absolutely trashed this country, destroyed confidence in the poltical system, been absolutely wicked in their willingness to use mass migration to divide the english working class and buy votes while storing up heaven knows what for the future, treated scorland like an obedient servant, introduced poisonous US style culture war politics, smashed pensions and priced younger people out homes for the envisagable future, lied their way into major wars, are led by people who clearly think much of the demographic the party was formed for a Neanderthal bigots, have unleashed every vindictive censorious inquisitorial instinct in the british population with banning, no platforming, silencing now a feature of british life....

That is distasteful.

Apart from that though

 

[gun ainm]

Not really. English turned from lib dem to Tory and bottled out of voting ukip on the back of fear of a party who doesn't want your country to exist getting positions of power in government.

Ironically after claiming to be on the end of it last year, it's fear mongering that's helped given snp their best ever result.

I am curious what you're conclusions are about the reaction of middle England to the prospect of Scottish influence at Westminster Proccie? If it is genuinely the case that they voted tory to keep the jocks out, does your unionism remain firm?

personally I think they voted tory on the economy and that the Scottish factor was overplayed BUT that may not be the case and I'll look forward to the analysis over the next few days. If you're convinced of your position however what does it mean for the UK?

 

[bigmanandy]

Some of the comments about Scottish Nationalism coming out of England are ridiculous and alot of English Nationalism talk and comments being said.

 

[southfieldhibby]

Eventually, Labour voters and sympathisers will have to look inwards and accept the blame rather than project it onto others.

 

[The__Proclaimer]

I am curious what you're conclusions are about the reaction of middle England to the prospect of Scottish influence at Westminster Proccie? If it is genuinely the case that they voted tory to keep the jocks out, does your unionism remain firm?

personally I think they voted tory on the economy and that the Scottish factor was overplayed BUT that may not be the case and I'll look forward to the analysis over the next few days. If you're convinced of your position however what does it mean for the UK?

It's nothing to do with jocks out - look at how many Scots have held powerful cabinet positions this generation - but jocks who want to breakup uk out.

Egb - your nationalism is perplexing. Understand you have hatred of Labour Party in UK but the alternative? A snp govt playing to the left wing gallery with an uncertain income, Greek levels of public spending, no cuts, out of control welfare and no one to blame. You honestly think that's better situation?

 

[The__Proclaimer]

Some of the comments about Scottish Nationalism coming out of England are ridiculous and alot of English Nationalism talk and comments being said.

Scottish Nationalism = Good.
English Nationalism = Bad.

Explain that one, always puzzled me.

 

[Smurf]

Why would a party with an absolute majority offer anything?

England defeat Labour all by themselves and Scotland won't matter at all.

Time will tell but as Andrew Marr said on tv last night they "...need to reconcile Scotland or lose it".

As I said during the campaign it amazes me that pro independent folk like yourself can't see the implications of this SNP LANDSLIDE.

It will amaze me if something huge isn't offered to Scotland.

 

[southfieldhibby]

Time will tell but as Andrew Marr said on tv last night they "...need to reconcile Scotland or lose it".

As I said during the campaign it amazes me that pro independent folk like yourself can't see the implications of this SNP LANDSLIDE.

It will amaze me if something huge isn't offered to Scotland.

You can't lose something you didn't have anyway Kenny.

 

[Smurf]

Still with this, Proc? Under your analysis, Tories used Scottish voters as the bogeyman. Labour joined in with them by embracing austerity and rejecting a pact with the SNP.

Labour did it to themselves. Dinnae blame us.

Did you watch nothing of the campaign in England? FFS Gideon Osborne was even spinning for Nicola Sturgeon after one of the debates. The English media was full of concerned English voters of the SNP having huge influence within *their* government.

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i have sympathy with the way you've held your corner in the face of nat belligerence on here. But the obvious riposte here is that labour have absolutely trashed this country, destroyed confidence in the poltical system, been absolutely wicked in their willingness to use mass migration to divide the english working class and buy votes while storing up heaven knows what for the future, treated scorland like an obedient servant, introduced poisonous US style culture war politics, smashed pensions and priced younger people out homes for the envisagable future, lied their way into major wars, are led by people who clearly think much of the demographic the party was formed for a Neanderthal bigots, have unleashed every vindictive censorious inquisitorial instinct in the british population with banning, no platforming, silencing now a feature of british life....

That is distasteful.

Your hatred for Labour is known but that's not why this result has developed... There was a HUGE change in voting intention. In England (yes England) ALL the polling data demonstrated that Labour was as a brand was more favourable than the Tories. So your typical anti Labour rant doesn't stand up to scrutiny as to why Labour has lost so heavily. Personally I think Labour has lost because;

A, The economy is doing well.
B, The fear in England of the SNP in their government. It was the Tory relentless message.
C, Ultimately Ed Miliband v David Cameron was always going to be a negative for Labour.

 

[egb_hibs]

Egb - your nationalism is perplexing. Understand you have hatred of Labour Party in UK but the alternative? A snp govt playing to the left wing gallery with an uncertain income, Greek levels of public spending, no cuts, out of control welfare and no one to blame. You honestly think that's better situation?

By far my bigger concern is that the western model of free society is itself dying. Something you may have noticed over the years. Scottish independence permits at least two experiments in how that might be escaped. Scotland can trial the small, culturally coherent social democracy, England the more free and open society no longer distorted by the drag of poltically correct politics of self destruction (though the institutions and establishment will take some shifting). If one or both work they provide templates for others. This UK pissing match is a complete sideshow to what is of real concern IMHO.

But within the UK, scotland desperately needs to grow up, get real, recover its dignity and stand on its own two feet. This will also benefit England as above. Yes this is contradictory to what imdependence is being sold on - you are completely correct that if you want more forelock tugging state socialism the union is the way to go. But it's not my fault that other yessers are selling and buying this snake oil and it doesn't deter me from the overarching goal of independence - it is in fact the only way that scots will come to recognise snake oil when it's offers to the.

 

[Smurf]

Eventually, Labour voters and sympathisers will have to look inwards and accept the blame rather than project it onto others.

Confused by this? Who is blaming others? Labour lost this election. The Tories in England ultimately had a better leader, record and plan according to the electorate. Up here in Scotland the Labour brand is toxic and not trusted to represent Scotland. And confounded further with poor Scottish and UK leadership. I would suggest we will see a very introspective Labour Party in Scotland and the UK. They LOST. Hugely.

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You can't lose something you didn't have anyway Kenny.

No idea what you mean? Can you not see that even the Tories know full well they have NO legitimacy whatsoever to govern Scotland? Do you honestly believe they'll try and ignore the Scottish result?

 

[egb_hibs]

Your hatred for Labour is known but that's not why this result has developed... There was a HUGE change in voting intention. In England (yes England) ALL the polling data demonstrated that Labour was as a brand was more favourable than the Tories. So your typical anti Labour rant doesn't stand up to scrutiny as to why Labour has lost so heavily.

1. I don't hate labour but I deplore what they've become
2. Sorry, the polls have long showed 'blukip' as way more popular in England and snp in Scotland. Just because an unfair FPTP favoured labour (kiss that goodbye) shouldnt blind you to the situation with actual levels of support
3. The bullying, intimidatory culture of poltical correctness has once again burned it's champions as despite point 2 people seem to have understated their position due to the harrying inquisitorial culture in respect of anti establishmenr views
4. I invite you to do the psephological research on the labour voting blocks I mention. I may have predicted it all along but I'm no longer relying here on my own reasoning. Go forth and Google

Personally I think Labour has lost because;

A, The economy is doing well.
B, The fear in England of the SNP in their government. It was the Tory relentless message.
C, Ultimately Ed Miliband v David Cameron was always going to be a negative for Labour.

nothing to disagree with there? Not sure how this demurs from anything I have said?

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Smurf, I take it you've noticed blukip have a bigger vote share than labour + LD + snp + greens? UKIP alone have 2/3 the votes of the other three combined.

Labours strategy seems to me to have been about chasing the 1.1m green voters while alienating the 3.8m gone to UKIP and 1.5m gone to snp. Sheer Marie Antoinette-ish lunacy. This is what happens when you become suckered by your own London echo chamber amplified by the BBC

 

[southfieldhibby]

Time will tell but as Andrew Marr said on tv last night they "...need to reconcile Scotland or lose it".

You can't lose something you didn't have anyway Kenny.

No idea what you mean? Can you not see that even the Tories know full well they have NO legitimacy whatsoever to govern Scotland? Do you honestly believe they'll try and ignore the Scottish result?

Thought it was pretty straight forward? The Tories can run The UK without a care for Scotland because they've been that very mandate from the English electorate.It's been very explicate all along...vote Tory and EVEL will take priority.The back benches of Toryism will demand that more than Cameron can offer anything significant to Scotland.

 

[gun ainm]

Smurf, I take it you've noticed blukip have a bigger vote share than labour + LD + snp + greens? UKIP alone have 2/3 the votes of the other three combined.

while we're at it The SNP got 93,000 more votes than Labour, the Tories & the Lib Dems put together in Scotland - irretrievable split between England and Scotland? will/can Cameron save the union - i dont think that's his instinct and it wont be the instinct of his backbenchers

 

[StevieC]

Confused by this? Who is blaming others?

Margaret Curran was the first, Iain Davidson the second .. I then had to finally go to bed .. I've just surfaced but I'm sure there'll be lots more as the days progress though.

 

[HenryLB]

I am curious what you're conclusions are about the reaction of middle England to the prospect of Scottish influence at Westminster Proccie? If it is genuinely the case that they voted tory to keep the jocks out, does your unionism remain firm?

personally I think they voted tory on the economy and that the Scottish factor was overplayed BUT that may not be the case and I'll look forward to the analysis over the next few days. If you're convinced of your position however what does it mean for the UK?

Point of order, they could have voted to keep the SNP out, reasoning that it is unlikely to have the UK's interests at heart. That's not at all the same as voting to keep "the jocks" out.

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If they do offer something Nicola better check the small print because it will be in their interests not Scotland's

Like FFA. Or even independence.

 

[Chester Perry]

Political Editor of London's Evening Standard tweets

To the SNP cybernats who hurled so much abuse, well done on getting [MENTION=1902]David[/MENTION]_Cameron elected. You & [MENTION=2581]nicola[/MENTION]Sturgeon won it for the Tories
Joe Murphy

 

[Deansy]

1. I don't hate labour but I deplore what they've become
2. Sorry, the polls have long showed 'blukip' as way more popular in England and snp in Scotland. Just because an unfair FPTP favoured labour (kiss that goodbye) shouldnt blind you to the situation with actual levels of support
3. The bullying, intimidatory culture of poltical correctness has once again burned it's champions as despite point 2 people seem to have understated their position due to the harrying inquisitorial culture in respect of anti establishmenr views
4. I invite you to do the psephological research on the labour voting blocks I mention. I may have predicted it all along but I'm no longer relying here on my own reasoning. Go forth and Google

nothing to disagree with there? Not sure how this demurs from anything I have said?

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Smurf, I take it you've noticed blukip have a bigger vote share than labour + LD + snp + greens? UKIP alone have 2/3 the votes of the other three combined.

Labours strategy seems to me to have been about chasing the 1.1m green voters while alienating the 3.8m gone to UKIP and 1.5m gone to snp. Sheer Marie Antoinette-ish lunacy. This is what happens when you become suckered by your own London echo chamber amplified by the BBC

I'm a political novice and have no wish (much less, a clue !) who's right/wrong in this debate - BUT - THAT line, for me sums it all !!

 

[Desperate Dan]

Why would a party with an absolute majority offer anything?

England defeat Labour all by themselves and Scotland won't matter at all.

Nothing new there then. Once again the vote in Scotland is irrelevant and we get a tory government we never voted for. The only way Scotland will get what it wants is when only Scotland votes for it, too bad that chance wisnae taken because of the westminster lackys voting tae keep their own country down. Hopefully this result will help speed up the break up of this stinking union.

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Still with this, Proc? Under your analysis, Tories used Scottish voters as the bogeyman. Labour joined in with them by embracing austerity and rejecting a pact with the SNP.

Labour did it to themselves. Dinnae blame us.

Liebour people still blaming everybody else for their failings, nae surprise there then.

 

[Desperate Dan]

Eventually, Labour voters and sympathisers will have to look inwards and accept the blame rather than project it onto others.

But I wouldnae haud yer breath.

 

[GORDONSMITH7]

Nothing new there then. Once again the vote in Scotland is irrelevant and we get a tory government we never voted for. The only way Scotland will get what it wants is when only Scotland votes for it, too bad that chance wisnae taken because of the westminster lackys voting tae keep their own country down. Hopefully this result will help speed up the break up of this stinking union.

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I take it you are also referring to people in Tory free Merseyside and North East, the majority in the North West, Yorkshire and Humberside, Wales, the West Midlands and London.

BIG G

 

[Purple & Green]

Even if labour had kept all the Scottish seats they would have had to taken out 60? more seats in England that were won by Tories, and we're supposed to believe this would have happened but for the snp making seats swing Tory?

Ive heard some deluded stuff, but that tops the lot


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Shades]

Even if labour had kept all the Scottish seats they would have had to taken out 60? more seats in England that were won by Tories, and we're supposed to believe this would have happened but for the snp making seats swing Tory?Ive heard some deluded stuff, but that tops the lotSent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

And has just been peddled on QT by Alastair Campbell.

 

[PILTONSTANY]

When you think about how shitty the Tories have acted and treated folk then you see the results and the colours on the map,You wonder how Labour managed to make such a James Hunt of it?

I think the working class areas the Big G refers to might have to look for a new hope,there aren't many left.....


Election 2015 - BBC News

 

[GORDONSMITH7]

And has just been peddled on QT by Alastair Campbell.

I saw that bastard with fellow right winger and obnoxious Lord John Reid this morning before I went to bed at 5.00 peddling a dewy eyed look back at New Labour/Blairism ludicrously suggesting that was the way forward. As I have said on here before Mandelson and other horrors are waiting in the wings.

BIG G

 

[Jack]

I take it you are also referring to people in Tory free Merseyside and North East, the majority in the North West, Yorkshire and Humberside, Wales, the West Midlands and London.

BIG G

I wonder if the SNP would have taken seats in these areas with the commitments they made?

Labour are accusing the SNP of nicking their policies whereas most seem to see it as the policies they abandoned.

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Sorry there should be a smilie in there somewhere.

 

[Jack]

"Sturgeon and Cameron spoke by phone before ceremony at the Cenotaph They appeared together at the VE ceremony but aides say no discussions."

Personally I don't think the Torys give a fuck about Scotland and Alex Salmond and wee Nikki have a monumental task to keep the momentum going against a series of what will look like concessions but will in fact be absolute shaftings.

 

[SKII]

If this is preempting Full Fiscal Autonomy what do people think the upshot of this will be for the people of Scotland in the short to medium term?

What choices around spending will need to be made - and what ones will people buy into?

What choices around taxation will need to be made - and likewise what ones will people buy into?

 

[emerald green]

If this is preempting Full Fiscal Autonomy what do people think the upshot of this will be for the people of Scotland in the short to medium term?

What choices around spending will need to be made - and what ones will people buy into?

What choices around taxation will need to be made - and likewise what ones will people buy into?

I dont see how tax could be even 1p higher in scotland compared to the england wales and NI.

Complete suicide to be seen as more "expensive" to live in Scotland.

Presuming, FFA means we still have to pay for the core national interests.... defence for example