This is interesting...

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ZemmamasBarnet

ZemmamasBarnet

Private Member
Joined
Apr 19, 2005
...for whatever reason, I was involved in a conversation about this pair recently

news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/merseyside/8546528.stm
(Posted fae ma mobile fone)
 
Im sad that the lad is back inside after being given a second chance. Over the years my opinion on the two killers of Jamie Bulger has changed immensely. I was young myself at the time and got caught up in the red top frenzy. I reckon if The Sun had had it's way we would have publicly executed two 10 year old children


Here is another interesting article which is relevant

http://www.communitycare.co.uk/Articles/2000/06/06/8245/The-murder-of-innocence.htm
 
Flasher said:
Im sad that the lad is back inside after being given a second chance. Over the years my opinion on the two killers of Jamie Bulger has changed immensely. I was young myself at the time and got caught up in the red top frenzy. I reckon if The Sun had had it's way we would have publicly executed two 10 year old children


Here is another interesting article which is relevant

http://www.communitycare.co.uk/Articles/2000/06/06/8245/The-murder-of-innocence.htm
Click to expand...

That is an excellent piece.

Even back then I saw only kids in the faces of those disturbed boys. I often question myself on this subject, if I was Jamie's father, would I seek retribution against a young boy? Would I feel no empathy for him or his family? I suppose it all depends on circumstances.

Adults that abuse and blame their history can get to fuck as far as I'm concerned but children, they deserve far more understanding.

I know the above will upset/annoy/perplex a lot of folk but I'd ask you attempt to stand back and look at it objectively.

We have much to learn.
 
Brainwrong said:
That is an excellent piece.

Even back then I saw only kids in the faces of those disturbed boys. I often question myself on this subject, if I was Jamie's father, would I seek retribution against a young boy? Would I feel no empathy for him or his family? I suppose it all depends on circumstances.

Adults that abuse and blame their history can get to fuck as far as I'm concerned but children, they deserve far more understanding.

I know the above will upset/annoy/perplex a lot of folk but I'd ask you attempt to stand back and look at it objectively.

We have much to learn.
Click to expand...

I wasnt that much older than the boys at the time and felt they should have known what they were doing was wrong, and that they deserved to be severely punished. Years later as an adult reviewing the situation, i am horrified that we tried two kiddies as adults and imprisoned them at 10 years old. I dont see how we can expect to 'fix' them by sticking them in borstal. I just feel sorry for them now and a wee bit ashamed that i judged them so harshly. The crime was evil, i dont believe the children were. I cannot imagine how utterly devastating it must be to be judged all your days on something you did when you were 10 years old
 
Flasher said:
I wasnt that much older than the boys at the time and felt they should have known what they were doing was wrong, and that they deserved to be severely punished. Years later as an adult reviewing the situation, i am horrified that we tried two kiddies as adults and imprisoned them at 10 years old. I dont see how we can expect to 'fix' them by sticking them in borstal. I just feel sorry for them now and a wee bit ashamed that i judged them so harshly. The crime was evil, i dont believe the children were. I cannot imagine how utterly devastating it must be to be judged all your days on something you did when you were 10 years old
Click to expand...

I think the media obviously played a massive part in this as detailed by your link. I was about 16 at the time. If I remember correctly, a lot of the blame was laid with one of the dads due to letting him/them watch Childs Play and other horror flicks.
The media should hang its head in shame, for this and a continuing stream of Busta Bloodvessel style pish.
 
Flasher said:
Im sad that the lad is back inside after being given a second chance. Over the years my opinion on the two killers of Jamie Bulger has changed immensely. I was young myself at the time and got caught up in the red top frenzy. I reckon if The Sun had had it's way we would have publicly executed two 10 year old children


Here is another interesting article which is relevant

http://www.communitycare.co.uk/Articles/2000/06/06/8245/The-murder-of-innocence.htm
Click to expand...

A very good article and IMO rightfully damning of the tabloid press in this country.

AFAIC The justice system has tried very hard to reconcile the Bulger case and made a fairly reasonable job of it. I don't believe that our society should be one where we put 10 year old children into jail until they die and I'm glad that we haven't.

What I find worrying is that there seems to be a vocal minority of people in the UK (unconnected with the victims and their families) who would have 10 year old children executed by the state.
 
TariqE said:
A very good article and IMO rightfully damning of the tabloid press in this country.

AFAIC The justice system has tried very hard to reconcile the Bulger case and made a fairly reasonable job of it. I don't believe that our society should be one where we put 10 year old children into jail until they die and I'm glad that we haven't.

What I find worrying is that there seems to be a vocal minority of people in the UK (unconnected with the victims and their families) who would have 10 year old children executed by the state.
Click to expand...

Read some of the comments after this article
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/p...ulger-killers-identifying-them-was-a-mistake/

Im not sure the vocal minority is that small tbh. Some people really feel strongly that these kids shouldve been exterminated or locked up til they died.

One guy has managed to quote luke skywalker and darth vader in his argument which is just stunning.:giggle: Worth a read for that alone surely
 
Flasher said:
Read some of the comments after this article
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/p...ulger-killers-identifying-them-was-a-mistake/

Im not sure the vocal minority is that small tbh. Some people really feel strongly that these kids shouldve been exterminated or locked up til they died.

One guy has managed to quote luke skywalker and darth vader in his argument which is just stunning.:giggle: Worth a read for that alone surely
Click to expand...

Aye, star wars was amusing. But I think this one is the one that I endorse

Id be willing to bet the same people who believe that these two reprobates can actually be reformed also believe in the Easter Bunny. James Bulger wasnt inadvertantly killed during a childish prank gone wrong. He was brutally murdered in a manner that was cold, calculating, depraved and apparently enjoyable to the two perps. The fact that they were children at the time simply doesnt negate that. In order to be reformed, one surely has to have empathy and they showed not even a smidgen of it how else could they have walked around for hours with a crying, two-year toddler and then brutalized him, even worse, without any apparent remorse
Click to expand...

I havent changed my opinion of the two. Children or not, they, IMO, knew what they were doing and knew what they were doing was wrong.
 
Dub said:
I havent changed my opinion of the two. Children or not, they, IMO, knew what they were doing and knew what they were doing was wrong.
Click to expand...

I also believe that they knew that what they were doing was wrong. I just don't believe that they should be locked up from age 10 until they die or executed.
 
Dub said:
I havent changed my opinion of the two. Children or not, they, IMO, knew what they were doing and knew what they were doing was wrong.
Click to expand...

IMO opinion they were mentally ill. None of us knows if they knew what they were doing or not. How lucid are disturbed children? This is not normal behaviour for ten years olds, kiddies arent just simply 'evil'.
 
Flasher said:
IMO opinion they were mentally ill. None of us knows if they knew what they were doing or not. How lucid are disturbed children? This is not normal behaviour for ten years olds, kiddies arent just simply 'evil'.
Click to expand...


Some of them are.




black_eyed_kids.jpg
 
I think the problem is somewhere between the poles these situations provoke.

I think the bleeding hearts are right in that these are disturbed children, and some of what was arrayed against them is frightening.

However I think that (sadly) the hang em and flog em brigade are right in that leopards rarely change their spots.

I have no idea what the answer is tbh.

Flasher said:
Here is another interesting article which is relevant

http://www.communitycare.co.uk/Articles/2000/06/06/8245/The-murder-of-innocence.htm
Click to expand...
whatever else is right or wrong in all this, those two cases don't sound comparable at all.
 
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