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Archie said:
You have seen who is making the claims?
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"This AGM reaffirms the right of free discussion and freedom to hold meetings for all organisations and individuals doing so within the law. Accordingly, whilst reaffirming the NCCL policy on the age of consent and the rights of children; particularly the need to protect those of prepubertal age, this AGM condemns the physical and other attacks on those who have discussed or attempted to discuss paedophilia, and reaffirms the NCCL's condemnation of harassment and unlawful attacks on such persons."
 
Smurf said:
"This AGM reaffirms the right of free discussion and freedom to hold meetings for all organisations and individuals doing so within the law. Accordingly, whilst reaffirming the NCCL policy on the age of consent and the rights of children; particularly the need to protect those of prepubertal age, this AGM condemns the physical and other attacks on those who have discussed or attempted to discuss paedophilia, and reaffirms the NCCL's condemnation of harassment and unlawful attacks on such persons."
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And? How is Harriet Harman responsible for this? BTW the person making the claims is a convicted paedophile and PIE member.
 
EH17 Jimmy said:
How did youngsters work and live abroad before the EU started?

When it was the EEC and was for trade.

And why or what is stopping youngsters going abroad to live and work now?
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Visas, access to instructions, fees, financial support. All given through the Erasmus scheme. All a barrier to citizens of non EU countries that aren't signed up to the scheme. Why would you deny young people this opportunity?
 
Who is stopping youngsters going abroad though Archie?

Have the EU told our youngsters to piss off?

And if they have did we tell their youngsters to piss off?

Financial support? Who is to pay them that then?

So the EU won't issue visas to our youngsters then?

And I'm no saying our youngsters shouldn't go abroad to study. Fair play to them.

But they are only a small part of our youngsters who need trained up in productive jobs.
 
EH17 Jimmy said:
Who is stopping youngsters going abroad though Archie?

Have the EU told our youngsters to piss off?

And if they have did we tell their youngsters to piss off?

Financial support? Who is to pay them that then?

So the EU won't issue visas to our youngsters then?

And I'm no saying our youngsters shouldn't go abroad to study. Fair play to them.

But they are only a small part of our youngsters who need trained up in productive jobs.
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This explains what the scheme offers.

Studying abroad

erasmus-plus.ec.europa.eu erasmus-plus.ec.europa.eu

Since Brexit it has been harder for UK students to study in EU countries. This rights that wrong. I accept that it will affect relatively few people, but why deny young people an opportunity? My sense is that you see any engagement with Europe as a betrayal of Brexit. I just don't see that.

If we were able to sort out a deal to save UK holidaymakers all the hassle we faced when going into EU countries would you oppose that too?
 
Archie said:
This explains what the scheme offers.

Studying abroad

erasmus-plus.ec.europa.eu erasmus-plus.ec.europa.eu

Since Brexit it has been harder for UK students to study in EU countries. This rights that wrong. I accept that it will affect relatively few people, but why deny young people an opportunity? My sense is that you see any engagement with Europe as a betrayal of Brexit. I just don't see that.

If we were able to sort out a deal to save UK holidaymakers all the hassle we faced when going into EU countries would you oppose that too?
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Nope Archie I don't see it as a betrayal at all I'm just wondering how this small number of youngsters are more important than the rest of the youngsters.

So let's say this Erasmus thing goes ahead then what provisions are there to help our youngsters who dont want to study abroad.

And I'm still at a loss as to why the EU won't let our youngsters study in their nations.

Do we tell their youngsters they can't study over here?

As someone who doesn't go abroad much I can't however see the problem with queues as well stand in queues all the time here.

When I have ventured out then I need my passport. And is it not true that some European nations have reintroduced border checks?
 
EH17 Jimmy said:
Nope Archie I don't see it as a betrayal at all I'm just wondering how this small number of youngsters are more important than the rest of the youngsters.
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No one says they are more important.
EH17 Jimmy said:
So let's say this Erasmus thing goes ahead then what provisions are there to help our youngsters who dont want to study abroad.
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Same as existed before we joined Erasmus
EH17 Jimmy said:
And I'm still at a loss as to why the EU won't let our youngsters study in their nations.
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It's not that they won't, but it's much more straightforward for countries in the scheme.
EH17 Jimmy said:
Do we tell their youngsters they can't study over here?
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No.
EH17 Jimmy said:
As someone who doesn't go abroad much I can't however see the problem with queues as well stand in queues all the time here.
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The new system for third countries has got off to a very rocky start. Some reports of three hour queues and people missing flights. It's because we can only stay 90 days in any 180 day period, so in and outs need recorded on a database through photos and fingerprints. It's done through machines so you can imagine the chaos.
EH17 Jimmy said:
When I have ventured out then I need my passport. And is it not true that some European nations have reintroduced border checks?
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Yes, but the process is different, as described above.
 
EH17 Jimmy said:
So let's say this Erasmus thing goes ahead then what provisions are there to help our youngsters who dont want to study abroad.
Click to expand...
Same as existed before we joined Erasmus


So nothing then. And although it may well be good for youngsters to study abroad I'm more concerned about youngsters here getting skills.
 
Archie said:
It's not one or the other. We left Erasmus after Brexit. So poorer deal for UK students.
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Yes Archie but UK students are not the be all and end all.

No I wouldn't want them denied the chance to study abroad if they so wish.

But as I stated I'm more concerned about youngsters learning skills in the UK that will benefit folk in the long run.
 
Archie said:
The new system for third countries has got off to a very rocky start. Some reports of three hour queues and people missing flights. It's because we can only stay 90 days in any 180 day period, so in and outs need recorded on a database through photos and fingerprints. It's done through machines so you can imagine the chaos.
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The machines are reasonably easy, just take a bit time. Although some folk find it hard to do.
The bigger problem is that as well as registering at some airports there is still a requirement to have passport stamped the old fashioned way.... so even bigger queues after the queues to do the scan........ and then of course the wideos start queue jumping, and wee arguments break out........

I'm seriously thinking of cutting down my euro travels to six or seven holidays a year.
:lookaround:
 
Aw poor auld android. Makes a hee haw of himself again 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣



Starmer’s hail mary “reset” speech this morning was around 65% reheated from the Labour conference address he delivered eight months ago in Liverpool.

A line-by-line analysis shows the same family anecdotes (albeit without the signature “toolmaker” refrain) , the same attack lines on Farage, the same education policy, and large chunks of the same phrasing.

As if it wasn’t torturous enough the first time…

To give just one example, the youth jobs guarantee was already announced by Rachel Reeves at conference and then repeated by Starmer in his own address.

So today was the third time lucky…


order-order.com

65% Of Starmer's "Reset" Speech Was Recycled From Conference Address

Starmer's hail mary "reset" speech this morning was around 65% reheated from the Labour conference address he delivered eight months ago in Liverpool. A
order-order.com order-order.com
 
Doc Shrink said:
The machines are reasonably easy, just take a bit time. Although some folk find it hard to do.
The bigger problem is that as well as registering at some airports there is still a requirement to have passport stamped the old fashioned way.... so even bigger queues after the queues to do the scan...... and then of course the wideos start queue jumping, and wee arguments break out......

I'm seriously thinking of cutting down my euro travels to six or seven holidays a year.
:lookaround:
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Was chatting tae a customs guy in the airport on our way home fae our last holiday and asked him if we need tae dae the same again when were going back 5 months later and he said we didnae.
Read up on it a while ago and the guy was right, apart from if you have a new passport... guess who got a new passport? :read:
 
Really can't see how getting rid of Starmer after only two years as PM is going to change Labour's fortunes.
It's completely senseless IMO.
He's made mistakes like every Prime Minister does, but he inherited a total shambles....and that takes time to fix.
It's his mainly left wing backbenchers who are behind all this of course....political pygmies who wouldn't be in their jobs if he hadn't won a massive majority in July 2024.

At the end of the day Labour are basically shiting themselves from Nigel Farage and Reform.
Do they seriously think that getting rid of Starmer and putting in someone like Burnham or Rayner is going to save them ?
MSM thriving on all this of course, and have relentlessly hyped the whole thing up to fever pitch.
IMO the whole thing has been overblown, and politics in this country is at the lowest ebb I can remember.

God help us.
 
Greenmachine said:
Really can't see how getting rid of Starmer after only two years as PM is going to change Labour's fortunes.
It's completely senseless IMO.
He's made mistakes like every Prime Minister does, but he inherited a total shambles....and that takes time to fix.
It's his mainly left wing backbenchers who are behind all this of course....political pygmies who wouldn't be in their jobs if he hadn't won a massive majority in July 2024.

At the end of the day Labour are basically shiting themselves from Nigel Farage and Reform.
Do they seriously think that getting rid of Starmer and putting in someone like Burnham or Rayner is going to save them ?
MSM thriving on all this of course, and have relentlessly hyped the whole thing up to fever pitch.
IMO the whole thing has been overblown, and politics in this country is at the lowest ebb I can remember.

God help us.
Click to expand...
They're also shitting it off the Greens taking the Muslim block. But this is the inevitable consequence of relying on identity politics. Labour’s traditional working class vote are leaving for Reform, while their middle class supporters are leaving them for the Lib Dems or Greens, along with the Muslim and LGBT votes. They're screwed. A general election tomorrow would all but wipe them out.
 
Sancho Panza said:
They're also shitting it off the Greens taking the Muslim block. But this is the inevitable consequence of relying on identity politics. Labour’s traditional working class vote are leaving for Reform, while their middle class supporters are leaving them for the Lib Dems or Greens, along with the Muslim and LGBT votes. They're screwed. A general election tomorrow would all but wipe them out.
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Do we think it'll trigger a GE? All bets off if so.
 
Reform is a party of freaks, misfits, women haters and hard core racists. Some of the fruitcakes who have become councillors are a prime example. They are led by tax dodging multi millionaires who will destroy workers rights....Even a half decent Labour leader should be able to expose them for what they really are
 
Greenmachine said:
Really can't see how getting rid of Starmer after only two years as PM is going to change Labour's fortunes.
It's completely senseless IMO.
He's made mistakes like every Prime Minister does, but he inherited a total shambles....and that takes time to fix.
It's his mainly left wing backbenchers who are behind all this of course....political pygmies who wouldn't be in their jobs if he hadn't won a massive majority in July 2024.

At the end of the day Labour are basically shiting themselves from Nigel Farage and Reform.
Do they seriously think that getting rid of Starmer and putting in someone like Burnham or Rayner is going to save them ?
MSM thriving on all this of course, and have relentlessly hyped the whole thing up to fever pitch.
IMO the whole thing has been overblown, and politics in this country is at the lowest ebb I can remember.

God help us.
Click to expand...
While I agree with this I don't think labour did themselves any favours on arrival at Downing Street.

After 14 years of tory mismanagement finding 100 quick fixes that would improve peoples lives in 100 days to show they were serious about fixing things would have got the people onside for the big issues.

Instead they went for big stuff that might show improvements down the line while at the same a series of gaffs and a record number of U turns and makes them look as incompetent as the torys.

Taking away the old folks heating allowance was perhaps one of the most stupid things any party has done in its first 6 months.
 
Thomo0762 said:
Reform is a party of freaks, misfits, women haters and hard core racists. Some of the fruitcakes who have become councillors are a prime example. They are led by tax dodging multi millionaires who will destroy workers rights....Even a half decent Labour leader should be able to expose them for what they really are
Click to expand...
Mirror image of the Greens.
 
Greenmachine said:
Really can't see how getting rid of Starmer after only two years as PM is going to change Labour's fortunes.
It's completely senseless IMO.
He's made mistakes like every Prime Minister does, but he inherited a total shambles....and that takes time to fix.
It's his mainly left wing backbenchers who are behind all this of course....political pygmies who wouldn't be in their jobs if he hadn't won a massive majority in July 2024.

At the end of the day Labour are basically shiting themselves from Nigel Farage and Reform.
Do they seriously think that getting rid of Starmer and putting in someone like Burnham or Rayner is going to save them ?
MSM thriving on all this of course, and have relentlessly hyped the whole thing up to fever pitch.
IMO the whole thing has been overblown, and politics in this country is at the lowest ebb I can remember.

God help us.
Click to expand...
It's an interesting point. I was chatting to a pal in Oz who's view was that Labour changing leaders all the time there handed the Liberals power for 12 years. Having said that, there's a 3 year window to turn this around. The key question is whether Starmer can do it? You could point to Thatcher who was equally unpopular two years in. But she stuck to her guns and delivered popular freebies through tax cuts and the right to buy. I probably think it's time to go.
 
Jack said:
While I agree with this I don't think labour did themselves any favours on arrival at Downing Street.

After 14 years of tory mismanagement finding 100 quick fixes that would improve peoples lives in 100 days to show they were serious about fixing things would have got the people onside for the big issues.

Instead they went for big stuff that might show improvements down the line while at the same a series of gaffs and a record number of U turns and makes them look as incompetent as the torys.

Taking away the old folks heating allowance was perhaps one of the most stupid things any party has done in its first 6 months.
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I completely agree. Might be a first.
 
Thomo0762 said:
Reform is a party of freaks, misfits, women haters and hard core racists. Some of the fruitcakes who have become councillors are a prime example. They are led by tax dodging multi millionaires who will destroy workers rights....Even a half decent Labour leader should be able to expose them for what they really are
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And the difference from other parties is what?
 
paigntonhibby said:
And the difference from other parties is what?
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The fact that, as a new party, it's a magnet for all sorts that haven't been properly vetted and have little experience. You can see that in resignations of people elected last week. Also, they have a party leader whos finances are, to say the least, very murky with unaccounted extremely large foreign donations that he forgets to declare. Added to that a key member jailed for taking bribes from Russia. That's pretty good going for a new party.
 
Archie said:
, it's a magnet for all sorts that haven't been properly vetted and have little experience
Click to expand...
And that's different from the Greens how? Party leader a complete fraud and fantasist, as well as a tax dodger. Two candidates arrested for racism. Scores more wrong 'uns and assorted weirdos.
Both them and Reform are as bad as each other, but only one seems to be held to account in progressive media circles.
 
A foreign gift that he didn't need to declare.
He's admitted that because he had to find a lot of candidates quickly some slipped through the vetting process, but I don't think he tried to appoint any of them to US ambassador.
You could be right though.
Meanwhile we have a PM who apparently doesn't get told anything by anybody.
Appoints ageing politicians including one who left the country in a right mess.
Accepted gifts for himself and his wife and then gifted the keys to number 10 to one of his donors.
Who promised to stop the boats , failed
Who promised to help waspi women, failed
Who promised to strengthen defence, failed
Who promised not to raise taxes, failed.
Whose ministers have had to resign for dodging taxes. Or
Evicting sitting tennents to re let at a higher price.
Let's not talk about mandelson who he claims he never knew about about what he'd done, why he'd been sacked, or that he was friends with a paedo while every other fucker in the UK that could read or had a tellybox knew exactly what a lying disgusting article he was.
Let's not talk about him appointing Gordon brown in a panic, a guy who left the country in as big a shit state for the tories as the tories left for Labour.
Oh I nearly forgot, another one with the whip removed but is in the house of Lords, another friend of a paedo.
I dont particularly trust farage , I do happen to like zia yousef.
But just explain why is reform racist?
And no, I don't vote for them i vote independent down here but in my view they are nowhere near as dangerous as the greens who Muslims are using as a trojan horse to gain political power
 
Sancho Panza said:
And that's different from the Greens how? Party leader a complete fraud and fantasist, as well as a tax dodger. Two candidates arrested for racism. Scores more wrong 'uns and assorted weirdos.
Both them and Reform are as bad as each other, but only one seems to be held to account in progressive media circles.
Click to expand...
I didn't say it was different and I think the Greens in Scotland and England have badly lost their way.
 
paigntonhibby said:
A foreign gift that he didn't need to declare.
He's admitted that because he had to find a lot of candidates quickly some slipped through the vetting process, but I don't think he tried to appoint any of them to US ambassador.
You could be right though.
Meanwhile we have a PM who apparently doesn't get told anything by anybody.
Appoints ageing politicians including one who left the country in a right mess.
Accepted gifts for himself and his wife and then gifted the keys to number 10 to one of his donors.
Who promised to stop the boats , failed
Who promised to help waspi women, failed
Who promised to strengthen defence, failed
Who promised not to raise taxes, failed.
Whose ministers have had to resign for dodging taxes. Or
Evicting sitting tennents to re let at a higher price.
Let's not talk about mandelson who he claims he never knew about about what he'd done, why he'd been sacked, or that he was friends with a paedo while every other fucker in the UK that could read or had a tellybox knew exactly what a lying disgusting article he was.
Let's not talk about him appointing Gordon brown in a panic, a guy who left the country in as big a shit state for the tories as the tories left for Labour.
Oh I nearly forgot, another one with the whip removed but is in the house of Lords, another friend of a paedo.
I dont particularly trust farage , I do happen to like zia yousef.
But just explain why is reform racist?
And no, I don't vote for them i vote independent down here but in my view they are nowhere near as dangerous as the greens who Muslims are using as a trojan horse to gain political power
Click to expand...
So a defence of Reform that's actually 95% an attack on Labour.

Some quick points:
- the assertion that he didn't have to declare the £5m is from Farage. You are full on about Starmer's suits but seem curiously uninterested in huge donations to Reform from foreign nationals. I expect you don't care about who paid for his house in Clacton?
- small boats numbers are down.
- defence spending is increasing.
 
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