Edinburgh to become a 20mph city

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One long piece of revenge for the congestion charge vote I suspect. Or maybe some fanatical attempt to drum up customers for the tram!

Edinburgh council transport is everything we have come to expect from statist bampottery

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I note that bus routes will stay at 30mph
 
I got that point from a link from the article in the OP - didn't notice the map (reading on phone)
 
Given the extended fuckwittery of Edinburgh council and their road management, there won't be too much difference between how fast you can drive now and after this new law comes in.

I'm not that fussed by this, but I really really hate the council...which is enhanced every single day I walk passed Leith water world.

Having read the article, i'm more annoyed at the removal of free parking on sundays and seven day parking restrictions.
 
egb_hibs said:
One long piece of revenge for the congestion charge vote I suspect. Or maybe some fanatical attempt to drum up customers for the tram!

Edinburgh council transport is everything we have come to expect from statist bampottery

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I note that bus routes will stay at 30mph
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1,384 days ago the trams were due to debut on Leith Walk.
 
Doesn't matter what speed you drive at...the damned lights are designed to catch you every time :banger:
 
From the bridge to London road, if I reach 20 mph on matchdays I will be chuffed. :wink:

Seriously though , the cooncil are a cunch o bunts .
 
Why is Edinburgh cursed with these evangelists? First Begg, then Dawes, now Hinds. You would think after 30 years of getting it so spectacularly wrong again and again and again they might just come to the conclusion that they're not very good at traffic management and perhaps they might just as well leave well alone. But no, barely a month passes when there isn't some new announcement heralding the latest botch job on our roads.

I read the puff piece in the News. As always, Hinds, just like her predecessors Begg and Dawes, crows endlessly about how super-duper, spiffingly, wonderful it will all be, even daring to suggest it will be aped by other local authorities the length and breadth of the land. And her only prop is a survey, organised incidentally by a local authority that recently published the results of a consultation declaring 95% of Edinburgh residents were satisfied with the Council's performance. Aye, right!

What is the driver behind these moves to reduce speed limits? Do we have a major problem with road accidents in Edinburgh? Where are the stats? What are the trends? And where is the evidence that reducing the speed to 20mph will reduce accidents and fatalities? I will buy into anything that saves even only one life, but I want to know that reducing speed limits will have a real effect and is not just yet another anti-car measure by car-hating evangelists who happen to have got their hands on power in the city council.
 
BurbankHibee said:
Stop voting for them !
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Unhelpful. What would that achieve?

You will find that the parties and candidates don't split on these local issues.

I would give my vote to any party, barring UKIP or similar, that promised to reverse the traffic measures of the last 30 years that have near choked the city to death and made it such an effin pain to get around.

It's sad fact that people don't vote in local authority elections on local issues, like traffic, trams, public services, school closures, incompetence, corruption. Instead they elect local councils according to what the prevailing situation is at national level at the time. Usually, they use their vote as a protest against the sitting government.

According to the chattering classes in Scotland, people here want more accountability and transparency at a local level -- apparently we've all been politicised by the referendum. I await to see this in action. For years, we've had ample opportunity for real engagement at local council level, but when we got the chance we just voted, when we bothered at all, against the government.

I'm simplifying things, but you get my point ... I trust. :rascal:
 
20mph speed limits in the toon? Won't take them long to 'invest' in speed cameras all over the place now. They can dress it up however they want but it's nothing more than another cynical stealth tax by hammering motorists with fines to balance the council's books.
 
Peanut said:
Unhelpful. What would that achieve?

You will find that the parties and candidates don't split on these local issues.

I would give my vote to any party, barring UKIP or similar, that promised to reverse the traffic measures of the last 30 years that have near choked the city to death and made it such an effin pain to get around.

It's sad fact that people don't vote in local authority elections on local issues, like traffic, trams, public services, school closures, incompetence, corruption. Instead they elect local councils according to what the prevailing situation is at national level at the time. Usually, they use their vote as a protest against the sitting government.

According to the chattering classes in Scotland, people here want more accountability and transparency at a local level -- apparently we've all been politicised by the referendum. I await to see this in action. For years, we've had ample opportunity for real engagement at local council level, but when we got the chance we just voted, when we bothered at all, against the government.

I'm simplifying things, but you get my point ... I trust. :rascal:
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I do get your point but get some independents on the council, stop voting for the establishment or incumbents.
 
Its been a 20 mph speed limit in the residential areas of North Edinburgh for a few years,it's worked well accident wise.
I'm assuming the traffic still flows as i've no heard many moans before today...
 
There are quite a few 20 mph streets round my bit and it has made me much more conscious of my speed. When you are in a narrow road, with cars either side, 30mph feels too fast in a residential area with kids about. If this brings the average speed of traffic down and improves flow whats the problem? Most people just race between the lights anyway.
 
baggageandfibs said:
There are quite a few 20 mph streets round my bit and it has made me much more conscious of my speed. When you are in a narrow road, with cars either side, 30mph feels too fast in a residential area with kids about. If this brings the average speed of traffic down and improves flow whats the problem? Most people just race between the lights anyway.
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Because a one size fits all solution to different situations and problems is lazy stewardship and overly punitive. 20mph is quite rightly applied near schools and heavily populated residential areas with narrow streets but there are areas of the city which are neither and to drive on some of the roads in the middle of the night at 20mph when there is almost literally no one else on the road is frankly ridiculous and is quite simply a hammer looking for a nail. As Beagle says it will undoubtedly create revenue and that seems to represent the hammer which is looking for said nail very conveniently for the council.
 
Shades said:
Because a one size fits all solution to different situations and problems is lazy stewardship and overly punitive. 20mph is quite rightly applied near schools and heavily populated residential areas with narrow streets but there are areas of the city which are neither and to drive on some of the main arteries in the middle of the night at 20mph when there is almost literally no one else on the road is frankly ridiculous and is quite simply a hammer looking for a nail. As Beagle says it will undoubtedly create revenue and that seems to represent the hammer which is looking for said nail very conveniently for the council.
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I leave for my work at 06.15am every morning so that I avoid congestion, have better fuel consumption, shorter journey times etc. I never speed (no really, I don't) but these changes will add time, fuel consumption etc to my journey at a time of the day when there is next to nobody around. It's going to have an impact on my travel times and outlay. I have no alternative but to drive either and public transport dont connect where I live with where I work (well not unless I want a 5 hour round trip)...
 
Am I missing something here?

On ALL topics.....

Surely We elect them to do our bidding? Finances allowing...

When did this change?

Did I miss that meeting?

Are they, or not, Public Servants? :dunno:
 
SKII said:
I leave for my work at 06.15am every morning so that I avoid congestion, have better fuel consumption, shorter journey times etc. I never speed (no really, I don't) but these changes will add time, fuel consumption etc to my journey at a time of the day when there is next to nobody around. It's going to have an impact on my travel times and outlay. I have no alternative but to drive either and public transport dont connect where I live with where I work (well not unless I want a 5 hour round trip)...
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It is also discriminate in nature to those people who are transient in terms of their work. Those that go to the same place everyday at the same time will see a little change and probably a little more time added to their journey. How much is that time multiplied if you are a courier, a tradesmen or a taxi driver? As ever the consumer will see prices rise as time quite simply equals money. The council should try to remember that the relentless urge to push people use public transport can sometimes seem like a big two fingers to the goods and service industry for whom it is impossible regardless of how much they deface the city for trams.
 
I think SK11 and Shades raise good points, perhaps this would be better suited to hours between 6am to 10pm.

However, as a cyclist, I would be much happier if passing cars were made to slow down a bit. I also think this could encourage others onto their bikes. Perhaps if the journey time difference between car and active/public transport trips became more marginal this would encourage more car free journeys which has to be a good thing over the long term no?
 
Should tell them to ram there road tax up there hole now. I'm presuming road tax is for car owners to fund the roads and USE them. The city center is almost impossible to drive in, Grassmarket is closed at night so people can bevvy, and now you can only drive 20 mph. :banger:
 
Not going to Edinburgh any more is becoming much more likely for me these days
 
PILTONSTANY said:
Its been a 20 mph speed limit in the residential areas of North Edinburgh for a few years,it's worked well accident wise.
I'm assuming the traffic still flows as i've no heard many moans before today...
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Totally agree on side streets, or main roads that run past a school for example.

At the moment, 20mph limits come into play at certain tines in the day to coincide with the schools starting, lunch breaks etc.

The above is pragmatic and sensible, but to make the majority of main arterial routes 20mph 24/7 is ridiculous!
 
baggageandfibs said:
I think SK11 and Shades raise good points, perhaps this would be better suited to hours between 6am to 10pm. However, as a cyclist, I would be much happier if passing cars were made to slow down a bit. I also think this could encourage others onto their bikes. Perhaps if the journey time difference between car and active/public transport trips became more marginal this would encourage more car free journeys which has to be a good thing over the long term no?
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That all seems very idyllic, until you are a plumber trying to get round your appointments on a tight schedule or a delivery driver who has just worked out that he'll now be working for an extra hour a day. It seems appropriate here as well to note that motorists pay tax for the roads, cyclists don't so is it fair to always expect drivers to take it on the chin in favour of cyclists?

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baggageandfibs said:
Why? Assuming you live in Glenrothes as per your status the journey time spent in Edinburgh would be a small fraction of your overall journey.
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Believe me if you are not a regular driver in Edinburgh, which I no longer am, you can spend a considerable time locked in one way systems. The city centre seems to change the routes every time I go and how am I to know if I'm not a regular?
 
baggageandfibs said:
Why? Assuming you live in Glenrothes as per your status the journey time spent in Edinburgh would be a small fraction of your overall journey.
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I'm fed up being taken the piss out of with ridiculously slow speeds and increasingly shitty roads . When they start fining parents who's untrained offspring run over the road 50 yards from a crossing or cyclists weaving all over the shop on unlit bikes (often on pavements) ask me again . It's always the drivers :banger:
 
You'd be lucky to travel more than 20mph in central Edinburgh most days. It's when its late and the roads are quiet that frustrations will burn.

Barry news for cyclists if this comes to fruition.
 
zondervan said:
Totally agree on side streets, or main roads that run past a school for example.

At the moment, 20mph limits come into play at certain tines in the day to coincide with the schools starting, lunch breaks etc.

The above is pragmatic and sensible, but to make the majority of main arterial routes 20mph 24/7 is ridiculous!
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20 on side streets/residential and 30 on main drags seems reasonable to me :thumbgrin
 
Shades said:
That all seems very idyllic, until you are a plumber trying to get round your appointments on a tight schedule or a delivery driver who has just worked out that he'll now be working for an extra hour a day. It seems appropriate here as well to note that motorists pay tax for the roads, cyclists don't so is it fair to always expect drivers to take it on the chin in favour of cyclists?
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I doubt the delivery driver or plumber will be at a competitive disadvantage compared to other plumbers or delivery drivers, they'll just price it in and adapt like we will all have to do.

Also the road tax argument is a bit of a red herring as investment in cycling infrastructure is minuscule in comparison to that of vehicles. I am a driver and a cyclist and it is my car (along with others) which degrades the road infrastructure whereas bikes have no effect whatsoever so seems only fair that we should pay for its maintenance.
 
baggageandfibs said:
Also the road tax argument is a bit of a red herring as investment in cycling infrastructure is minuscule in comparison to that of vehicles. I am a driver and a cyclist and it is my car (along with others) which degrades the road infrastructure whereas bikes have no effect whatsoever so seems only fair that we should pay for its maintenance.
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That and the fact roads are paid from general taxation,we all pay for their upkeep regardless of use.
 
Shades said:
That all seems very idyllic, until you are a plumber trying to get round your appointments on a tight schedule or a delivery driver who has just worked out that he'll now be working for an extra hour a day. It seems appropriate here as well to note that motorists pay tax for the roads, cyclists don't so is it fair to always expect drivers to take it on the chin in favour of cyclists?

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Believe me if you are not a regular driver in Edinburgh, which I no longer am, you can spend a considerable time locked in one way systems. The city centre seems to change the routes every time I go and how am I to know if I'm not a regular?
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Yer getting stung if you're still paying road tax all these generations later.
 
Zitellis Heid said:
Am I missing something here?

On ALL topics.....

Surely We elect them to do our bidding? Finances allowing...

When did this change?

Did I miss that meeting?

Are they, or not, Public Servants? :dunno:
Click to expand...

When was it a politicians agenda, at ANY level, to 'serve the public'? Seems to me that serving themselves and their mates has always been the main driving force behind a desire for public office. :glassraise:
 
baggageandfibs said:
I doubt the delivery driver or plumber will be at a competitive disadvantage compared to other plumbers or delivery drivers, they'll just price it in and adapt like we will all have to do.

Also the road tax argument is a bit of a red herring as investment in cycling infrastructure is minuscule in comparison to that of vehicles. I am a driver and a cyclist and it is my car (along with others) which degrades the road infrastructure whereas bikes have no effect whatsoever so seems only fair that we should pay for its maintenance.
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How does the parcel delivery driver 'price it in' when he's on a fixed rate for his amount of drops? 12 hour shifts will just become even longer.
 
baggageandfibs said:
I doubt the delivery driver or plumber will be at a competitive disadvantage compared to other plumbers or delivery drivers, they'll just price it in and adapt like we will all have to do. Also the road tax argument is a bit of a red herring as investment in cycling infrastructure is minuscule in comparison to that of vehicles. I am a driver and a cyclist and it is my car (along with others) which degrades the road infrastructure whereas bikes have no effect whatsoever so seems only fair that we should pay for its maintenance.
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As I said - the consumer will now see prices rise as a direct result. Big firms can also absorb costs easier and squeeze a little bit more from their employees and sole traders are in direct competition with them. I'll bow out of the Cyclist v Driver debate because I'm steadfastly on the side of the driver.
 
Cycling on a day like today is an option for most folk right enough.
 
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