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Who else thinks that RG views this season as a learning ground?

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Consistently? Where is this consistency?

- The last two games against full-time opposition (Huns and Morton).

What constitutes late?

- Inside the last ten to fifteen minutes of the match. (We conceded four inside this time frame to Huns and one to Morton.)

Individual players, yes, since we're naming Steven, individual players, who have had umpteen injuries and at the latter stage of his career, it's hardly surprising?

- I disagree. There are plenty of players in footballing history who have played well into their thirties after suffering injuries, but regained fitness and generally not perpetrated the type of error SW did on Saturday.

I think you're right in the fact that this is circular... we could do this all day.

- Yes, we could. We don't agree. We have different opinions. I can't prove you wrong and neither can you prove me wrong. Some people reading this will be more persuaded by your argument, others by mine. It is a subjective, rather than an objective, issue.

One last point though.
What is your definition of fitness.

- As detailed ad nauseum in several posts above, I contend that fitness (as it applies to professional football players) is not an absolute concept, but rather a relative one. My definition of fitness within this context is that if you are less fit than your opponents, you're not fit enough.

What exactly are the players lacking?

- Again, as both of us have posited ad nauseum, I believe that they lack fitness, primarily. And that this malaise has manifested itself in our tendency to concede late, unnecessary goals as we have consistently demonstrated in our last two matches against full-time opponents.

Because theres about 7 or 8 different aspects of fitness and a player with high endurance can have low strength and speed.

- You sound as if you are an expert, or believe you are an expert on fitness amongst footballers. I'd be interested to know why and how. Genuinely. As someone who still runs 9 miles thrice weekly at the age of 47, fitness is something I'm interested in.

So if your casing it on a players ability to run at 100% for 90 minutes your singling out certain areas and ignoring others.

- That is a sweeping generalisation, which I refute.
 

Hammi

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John Collins' squad was fit as... Attitudes were the problem.
Famous Man utd side, scoring late goals any time they needed them, came down to the players and manager being outright winners, no doubt they were in shape, but so was that Bayern side.

I'm not concerned yet about the late goals, more concerned at the manner of the goals we concede.
Still allow players to run at us, still allow crosses into the box.

I'm no expert, but my highers in P.E where I had to design training programs, gave me an insight into what fitness actually is.
Fitness is a general term that relates to;
Cardiovascular endurance, muscular endurance, strength, speed and flexibility.
$%#@ recall the rest, theres at least 2 more.

It's good that you run as much as you do.
I $%#@ do much running anymore, but I'm still physically fit.
So if I $%#@ run as far as you, as often as you, youd say I'm less fit than you.
But I'd probably out perform you in other areas and then youd look less fit.

Fitness is a general term. Fitness isnt something you can measure on it's own merit.
 

Hammi

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Fitness doesn’t win a game of football - that comes down to application, attitude and desire.

Winners in any sport aren’t the most physically or technically gifted, they are tho ones who are the strongest mentally.
Hard work beats talent, when talent doesnt work hard.
 

Jello Biafra

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John Collins' squad was fit as... Attitudes were the problem.
Famous Man utd side, scoring late goals any time they needed them, came down to the players and manager being outright winners, no doubt

I'm not concerned yet about the late goals, more concerned at the manner of the goals we concede.
Still allow players to run at us, still allow crosses into the box.

I'm no expert, but my highers in P.E where I had to design training programs, gave me an insight into what fitness actually is.
Fitness is a general term that relates to;
Cardiovascular endurance, muscular endurance, strength, speed and flexibility.
$%#@ recall the rest, theres at least 2 more.

It's good that you run as much as you do.
I $%#@ do much running anymore, but I'm still physically fit.
So if I $%#@ run as far as you, as often as you, youd say I'm less fit than you.
But I'd probably out perform you in other areas and then youd look less fit.

Fitness is a general term. Fitness isnt something you can measure on it's own merit.
Hammi, I wouldn't necessarily make such a sweeping judgement about your fitness relative to mine. Our debate has been about fitness in the specific context of football matches and its significance as a deciding factor. We've debated at length and we would appear not to agree. That's fine.

Thank you for your time in detailing your knowledge of fitness in its manifold manifestations. And glad you appear to be someone who also takes the time to keep yourself fit.

Enjoy the game on Saturday. Here's hoping we win and one time when I'm up I'll buy you a pint!
 

Hammi

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Huns goals, were down to us being a man down and just giving up while we were on the park accepting defeat.
 

SuperTortolano

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Fancy explaining the thought process then?
Just completely unsubstantiated and there more people that think and say this without anything to go on, will lead to the more and more people thinking this.

We hadn't even heard from him before folk were already saying hes using it for the land at station etc.

Hes never been in football before, let alone football across the other side of the world.
It makes sense that it will take him time to understand the intricacies and what needs adjusted where.

You $%#@ come up with a full plan to overhaul the club before you've even bought it.
Are you even allowed to pour over every detail before you even get in the door?
Seems like if that was the case, you could turn around and not take over and the have all this crazy knowledge about the ins and outs, and use it as you see fit.


The only real downside for me, at this moment in time.
Is that hes done this for a hobby, he hasn't bought a football club because he wants the biggest and beat football club around (city, chelsea, PSG, etc etc) so that's why theres no massive influx of cash to a transfer budget and players

It's a pleasure thing and his ideas about where he wants us to be wont come to pass until hes got his own idea about what's actually possible.

Also if hes listening to leeann, and shes happy with how every area of the club is, then he might agree with her, as shes in the know, and he isnt.


Theres time, poor start to the season is drawing too much attention to all these other things.
I gave my thought process. It’s just my opinion on how I see things being played out.
 

HenryLB

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Hard work beats talent, when talent doesnt work hard.
Yeah I agree. I think it'll often appear more talented as well. Football is so tied up with athleticism - fit players make better, faster decisions and execute them more efficiently.
 

Fauldhoose

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When you buy a business
You do due diligence
You have a business plan for your partners/funders/bank
You relay your vision to the people you are buying from

Would be surprised if he is sitting back for 12 months to learn the “game” and assess what needs to be done
 

HenryLB

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When you buy a business
You do due diligence
You have a business plan for your partners/funders/bank
You relay your vision to the people you are buying from

Would be surprised if he is sitting back for 12 months to learn the “game” and assess what needs to be done
So would I. But there's a bit of a difference between mapping out where you want to get to (and working out if that's theoretically possible with the structure that's there) and then going in and really discovering on a granular level what's happening and what changes you want to make.

Like for example your due diligence might show that you're making, I dunno, 250k a year from food sales and that per capita of tickets sold that's lower than other Scot Prem clubs. You'd note that - and as you say, alert partners via your plan - and then once you'd bought the club you'd go in and try to find out why, and how you can raise it.

I wonder if there's a difference in attitude in the US as well. My impression is that because of salary caps, drafts, limits on signing players etc, they're a bit more... considered in how they do things? Like they're used to building things up slowly. Maybe Bouncers who know more in detail about US sport have an opinion.
 

Purple & Green

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US sport is the paradox - the biggest free market on the planet, and their sport is set up in a way that makes it a level playing field. I seem to remember that the league owns the rights to the franchises and therefore the teams, as opposed to the teams making up an association and running for the benefit of their shareholders over for example the league.

I think RG has a clear idea of the direction of travel. He first though needs to understand where we are against his direction of travel to make the changes. Some departments might need little changes, some lots. I suspect most will get lots.

Does a £10M turnover business need 10 directors, with possibly more about to be appointed? I suspect not.

I suspect we will have half that by the end of the season, as the new broom sweeps through.

Change is good, change is bad, change is inevitable. But change is coming.

If you ask me :)
 

beefy

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I look forward to change.

Sent from my E5823 using Tapatalk
 

Jamie

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RG isnae the hooded claw. There is a 90 day lie period where he has requested all areas of the club report on their status. Probably each area will have to highlight their remit, what they do best, what they can improve on, their current KPIs etc etc.
Our fan rep has already stated such on a couple of occassions.

Whats he after? Only RG knows that really. What Im quite convinced about is he hasnae trawled the World looking for a company/fitba club tae run into the ground. Theres nae sence on that, and if he has changed tack from his entire career and now wants to buy companies and run them doon and close them for e.g. their land, FFS, i think he could have come up with something better than Hibernian FC. He cannae hawk land at EM, this has been brought under the club. Quite a few acreage for future tae. The ticket office and land surrounding it as also been brought under the club.

When he was announced etc, there seemed to be lots of chat towards Europe. Things would appear to be changing quite markedly in respect of Europe (proper inter country leagues it would look like)... and new markets to be tapped (fuck! if Hibernian FC operated in a non sectarian environment we would fucking flourish!!).

Whats been shit for us, imho is that the takeover has been so subdued!! 2 /3 big boy signings, proper quality, would have been a good start. Awfy awfy low key. RG should also be made 100% aware on what we have had to endure with Hibernian ploughing money into infrastructure while the first team (the reason for Hibernian FC in the first place) sufferered.
For fans to "pony up" for EM to be upgraded is a non starter.

For me, for now, RG has a pass. That pass runs to firstly the winter transfer window.
Not forgetting that all those acres at East Mines have mine workings under them so would cost a fortune to even get planning and no builder would pay top dollar for land that has coal mines under it.

We pony up season after season in buying STs, Strips etc etc.
 

Westside Green

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1) Not at all convinced. As pointed out elsewhere the owner was in discussion with the seller for months. Also, why would the owner turn down an albeit small strip sponsorship deal if it was all about the bottom line?

2) It is far too early to conclude whether we are stuck wi, or fortunate to have, Heckinbottom at the club. All we know just now is that the players can achieve much more than they are currently showing.

3) Again, it is far too early to conclude on how the next few months will pan out. If the defence stops gifting goals then we could easily go on a bit of a streak sooner rather than later.
Maybe turned down the crap sponsorship out of principal? When I had a taxi I was offered £400 to have it covered in advertising. I politely declined as it was less than I was prepared to accept. The guy was astounded that I would turn down 'free' money. Fuck being off the road for a day then getting less than 8 quid a week.
 

Hibee Kev

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Fitness doesn’t win a game of football - that comes down to application, attitude and desire.

Winners in any sport aren’t the most physically or technically gifted, they are tho ones who are the strongest mentally.
Hard work beats talent when talent doesn't work hard.

Who remembers the South Korea side from the 2002 world cup? They took this to extremes, ground teams down by turning the game into a 90 minute endurance test from which they usually prevailed.
 

Rocky

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Thank you. Again, however, I disgree with you on this issue. Our lack of fitness/perceived lack of fitness has been a particular bugbear of mine for much of the 36 years of my life I've spent as a supporter. I have a mind of my own and express my own opinions.

So, while I accept that in this day and age of social media domination 'internet myths' undoubtedly exist, my contention that Hecky's Hibs of this season - based on the evidence of the last two matches against full-time opponents - is, I believe, supported by hard, empirical facts.

You disagree. That's fine. We're all Hibbies, but we all have different perspectives.

Other posters, for example, Hammi, appear to share my concern about the late goals. However, he, again, for example, attributes this more to a lack of application; as opposed to a lack of fitness.

Again, I respectfully disagree with him.
We know that PHB makes extensive use of GPS vests and vital signs monitors (unlike the previous incumbent). I'd probably be more inclined to class the data from those as "hard, empirical facts" than counting late goals.
 

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I am with the tattoed fellae. Looking at the current first team squad I would suggest the following fitness levels, as Bossie says its all about opinions and this is mine:

Rocky - Looks fit but had little rest over the summer and missed a fair part of pre season.
Maxwell - Looks out of shape
Gray - Injured, not fit, missed a big part of pre season.
James - Injured, not fit
Whitts - Has looked very fit so far after a long time out injured.
Porteous - Returning from injury, missed a big part of pre season.
Jackson - Appears fit?
McGregor - Injured, not fit
Hanlon - Looks a yard slower than he was
Stevenson - Returning from injury, missed a big part of pre season.
Mackie - Looks fit, can work for a full game
Vela - Looks unfit, vanishes during games, missed a big part of pre season.
Slivka - Not fit yet, missed a big part of pre season.
Murray - Fit but still too slight.
Mallan - Looks fit and up for it
Allan - Getting fitter, he done the full 120 minutes last Saturday. The last 10 minutes of extra time he could barely run and had a heed like a beetroot.*
Newell - Looks well off the pace, not sure if its attitude or fitness o ra bit of both?
Horgan - Looks fitter, rarely could give us more than 60 minutes, I think he can go a full game now.
Boyle - Injured, not fit
Kamberi - Has looked super fit
Doidge - Appears fit if off the pace of our game?
Oli - Fit, but easy pushed off a ball, too slight.
Middleton - Will be training fit but will need a few games to get going, tired badly last week.

* He did well given his Diabetes.
 

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