This reparations chat

egb_hibs

Private Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2002
Does anybody think it is not mental?

I mean it’s utterly bonkers in every possible way.

Those who seek to destroy society aside - no doubt eagerly involved in this as in anything else that furthers the aim - who could possibly think that taking money from a bunch of people who have nothing to do with slavery, and giving it to another bunch who have never been enslaved, is anything other than a recipe for social disaster?

As for the other side of it, giving money to Africa; do its kleptocrats and their Chinese overlords need any more lining of their pockets? Will Africa benefit from the world economy being cremated - as would be the case with more extreme scenarios such as the UN plum who decided Britain alone owes 18 trillion? And then there is the fact that Africa likely contains more descendants of slavers than anywhere else.

And if the sins of the fathers are to be visited on the sons, where does it stop ? Can those of us with Irish heritage expect a pay out (and be exempted from paying in to the descendants of slaves)? Will Africa give us some back for the long history of Corsair slaving runs to Europe or as reimbursement for expenses incurred in ending their slaving industry?

What about what England owes Scotland, and what Scotland owes Ireland, and what the Normans owe the Saxons and the Saxons owe the Celts and the Celts owe the Picts? Should the Arab world not only leave off Israel but give it a pile of cash to repent for their colonialism - before also paying out to Europe for depriving us of North Africa and the Middle East? And so on and on until Abel’s descendants present a bill to Cain’s. The Italians, Greeks, Germans, Brits, Arabs, Iranians, Turks, various countries of the Asian steppes, are going to need particularly deep pockets if the logic was followed through.

Britain surely paid out when it was actually meaningful…spending 2% of national income for 60 years to shut down the trade it had previously been part of. The other countries involved have, along with Britain, given trillions to grateful african despots over the last few decades.

And I wonder what do people even imagine to be the benefits in theory? New Zealand’s payments to Māoris have had a disastrous effect on a substantial number of the latter, encouraging a fair quota of people to prefer getting sozzled all day than work.

How have we let the usual mix of baddies, grifters and hapless sentimentalists get this idea back onto the table? Do we have a civilisational death wish, because it increasingly feels like it.
 
Instead of money offer to repatriate them to the country they reckon their ancestors came from, pretty sure they’d turn it down, any country in the commonwealth is better to live in than any country in west africa
 
Instead of money offer to repatriate them to the country they reckon their ancestors came from, pretty sure they’d turn it down, any country in the commonwealth is better to live in than any country in west africa
Give them all independence. Apart from anything else it widnae cost Glasgow as much tae put the Commonwealth Games on wi only 4 countries taking part. In fact give us independence tae and save Glasgow spending anything.🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿
 
Instead of money offer to repatriate them to the country they reckon their ancestors came from, pretty sure they’d turn it down, any country in the commonwealth is better to live in than any country in west africa
In the event reparations were to be paid to Africa, I wonder if black Britons would be exempted from any tax to fund it. I mean as I understand it the logic, it is that modern Britons benefit from the wealth generated (which is subject to various estimates from substantial to bobbins to a loss) during the slaving era.

Afaik black Britons aren’t excluded from these benefits, and so should presumably be ponying up with everyone else. Yes their (Afro Caribbean black Britons anyway) ancestors were the victims, but they are still economic beneficiaries like anyone else, if economics is the basis of the case. Im not sure that case makes sense though since west Africa sold those slaves to the Brits et al to begin with.

If otoh the basis is some kind of redress for harm done to distant ancestors, well in that case west Africa owes those black Britons as much if not more than the Uk does. And a whole bunch of people are owed by the same logic, per the op.

Mental.
 
It’s mental of course, but also entirely predictable from a group of nations who were colonized…that’s why they sit down together.

Maybe UK should realize this and dissolve the commonwealth.
They are wanting reparations for their slave industry going global and selling to Europeans. It’s some claim. Or maybe they want reparations for us subsequently shutting that industry down (in part via colonisation- oh the ironies)?
 
It'll be some jumped up nomark politician trying to impress his/her electorate for an upcoming vote they are likely to lose.

Calm doon everyone. It's no gonna happen.
 
Britain surely paid out when it was actually meaningful…spending 2% of national income for 60 years to shut down the trade it had previously been part of. The other countries involved have, along with Britain, given trillions to grateful african despots over the last few decades.
£20 million pounds (around £17 billion pounds today) actually was borrowed to be shared out amongst 46,000 slave owners, obviously not a penny was payed to those who had been enslaved and brutalised.
The fact that the loan was only payed off and revealed in 2015, British taxpayers would never have discovered they’d completed these loan repayments if someone in the British Government’s Treasury Department hadn’t posted this on its official Twitter channel to its hundreds of thousands of followers, very few at the time, knew about it including all posters on this thread I suspect.
Think about it you, your parents, grandparents and great grandparents etc have been paying taxes to compensate these miserable abominations of enslavers.
Since 2004 @egb can you clarify which despotic African despots have received £Trillions. What was Britains share of this.

BIG G
 
£20 million pounds (around £17 billion pounds today) actually was borrowed to be shared out amongst 46,000 slave owners, obviously not a penny was payed to those who had been enslaved and brutalised.
The fact that the loan was only payed off and revealed in 2015, British taxpayers would never have discovered they’d completed these loan repayments if someone in the British Government’s Treasury Department hadn’t posted this on its official Twitter channel to its hundreds of thousands of followers, very few at the time, knew about it including all posters on this thread I suspect.
Think about it you, your parents, grandparents and great grandparents etc have been paying taxes to compensate these miserable abominations of enslavers.
Since 2004 @egb can you clarify which despotic African despots have received £Trillions. What was Britains share of this.

BIG G
Money paid to slave owners may be galling but it helped get the job done. Also buttons compared to the cost of the naval campaign to put slavery down which is what I was referencing. I’ve tried to figure out what that might be, based on figures given of ~2% of national income annually for 60 years. Based on 1860 pounds and gdp that’s going to be somewhere around 15 trillion all in. Also cost an average of one British sailor’s life for every slave freed. Not a trivial exercise though my sums could be very wrong !

According to wiki, it’s calculated that 2.6 trillion USD has gone to Africa in aid since 1960. Fuck knows how much in other investment. Where does 2004 come into it? What’s the significance of that year? (Did you read few decades as two decades? I do that kind of thing lol)

As for despots, get out your maps and some pins and a page on African history. They’ve hardly gone short of them, and they weren’t shy in pockling their nations wealth including aid.
 
We've got similar nonsense going on here in California. It really is bonkers.

A task force was set up to figure out how much money should be given to descendants of slaves. All sorts of fanciful things have been thrown out there, like each descendant should get $1m+ each, $60k a year or something and get a house for a $1 and other stuff. t would cost the state billions of dollars and we are already skint. The only way to pay for it would likely be a special tax and that will get voted down. It's a charade. There are going to be a lot of disappointed folks over this. I
 
We've got similar nonsense going on here in California. It really is bonkers.

A task force was set up to figure out how much money should be given to descendants of slaves. All sorts of fanciful things have been thrown out there, like each descendant should get $1m+ each, $60k a year or something and get a house for a $1 and other stuff. t would cost the state billions of dollars and we are already skint. The only way to pay for it would likely be a special tax and that will get voted down. It's a charade. There are going to be a lot of disappointed folks over this. I
As ever, it’s easier for the right on set to blame events of centuries ago and demand other people pony up, than it is to admit the plight of black Americans has far more to do with the absence of fathers, domestic and social chaos, and other benefits of social progress.

The same is now being repeated in Britain. 63% of black kids in the UK are in single parent households. 81% of the poorest have no father in the household.

A lot more comfortable to bang on about the 1760s than contemplate the fruits of the 1960s methinks.
 
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Well quite. Sadly the descendants of these people are now viewed as inconveniences who ideally will be superseded.
 
How the feck did it come to this. This is clearly bonkers but people are discussing it. The rabbit hole folk are going down is getting bigger by the day. Total fantasy. My dad ,who fought in the war,ran two hospital wards and had two jobs to feed his family must be spinning in his grave at just how fucked up we've become. Logic and common sense tells you it's bonkers. Obviously that doesn't cut it anymore.😡
 
And folk are shocked reform got so many votes. Lecturing over 60s on how evil their ancestors were never going to go well. Easy to say when you'venot had to deal with life's issues.