The Election Poll

[1875]

I'm still torn between Labour and the SNP. My issue as such with the SNP is that all they talk about is their conditions to support a minority Labour Government. What's their course of action should we get a Tory minority or majority government?

In what way?

 

[southfieldhibby]

They'll be able to do nothing about a Tory Majority government and there won't be a minority Tory government because that would mean Labour/SNP could form a coalition government on the basis that no one would with sufficient numbers would support the tories.

 

[Rocky]

A question for my Nationalist amigos.....

Hypothetically if the situation arises in two weeks time that the Tories do not get a majority but the Labour Party can get a Government together with the support of the SNP, whether the mechanism were a coalition (ruled out by Nichola Sturgeon ) or confidence and supply, the red lines talked about so often, the immovable red lines.
The first red line of course is the question of Indyref2 taking place next year and the second the scrapping of Trident. Whether Jeremy, myself and 70% of the 500,000 members who would scrap Trident want it or not the supreme body as, is that of the SNP, is annual Conference. The Trade Unions opposed it because of their worry of the loss of thousands of their members jobs. That is another debate, however the fact is that Corbyn, nor anyone else can change that. Only the Conference can.
So what would you do? Compromise or not cross those red lines and de facto see the reactionaries back to continue their 10 years of devastation on workers and their families. I am too long in the tooth not to accept that compromise would apply to Labour too.

BIG G

I think the situation gets rather complicated if the arithmetic creates an opportunity for a coalition between SNP and a Corbyn government, for the simple reason that I think that whilst a) it creates a very strong position for the SNP to force through an Indyref it also b) makes it much less likely (imo) that they would win it. If a properly socialist UK government starts to deliver on its promises then I think that's something that a lot of Scots (me included) could get behind.

 

[Smurf]

I hope neither labour nor th torys get a large enough majority to push through any radical unpopular right or left wing ideology based policies unopposed . I dont trust Boris to not get shafted by the yanks in a trade deal and I dont trust corbyn with the security and defence of the country. I dont trust boris with the care of

I could be wrong but have they no' said they widnae support a Tory govt.

I think that's obvious that they wouldn't! My point relates to how under such circumstances they push for Indy Ref 2....

 

[Smurf]

In what way?

In the way Boris will say no to any requests for a referendum. What's their strategy to overcome that. Personally I'd like to see them proceed with the referendum anyway....

 

[Smurf]

They'll be able to do nothing about a Tory Majority government and there won't be a minority Tory government because that would mean Labour/SNP could form a coalition government on the basis that no one would with sufficient numbers would support the tories.

DUP will do a deal with the Tories for any minority Tory Government.

 

[greencol]

I think the situation gets rather complicated if the arithmetic creates an opportunity for a coalition between SNP and a Corbyn government, for the simple reason that I think that whilst a) it creates a very strong position for the SNP to force through an Indyref it also b) makes it much less likely (imo) that they would win it. If a properly socialist UK government starts to deliver on its promises then I think that's something that a lot of Scots (me included) could get behind.

W
We've had Labour governments in the past. Did any of them treat this nation as an equal?
Therein lies my problem. They're unionists. They dont want separation.
They're promising us the world on a platter.
They've done it before. Who's to say these platitudes are any different from previous promises.
How many times does this nation need its arse kicked before it realises that its painful?

 

[gun ainm]

I think the situation gets rather complicated if the arithmetic creates an opportunity for a coalition between SNP and a Corbyn government, for the simple reason that I think that whilst a) it creates a very strong position for the SNP to force through an Indyref it also b) makes it much less likely (imo) that they would win it. If a properly socialist UK government starts to deliver on its promises then I think that's something that a lot of Scots (me included) could get behind.

if a tory govt is a key driver for indy then a democratic socialist labour govt does slightly diminish the urgency (for me I am sure it changes nothing for many). BUT we would be crazy not to demand an early change in the law that'd enshrine the right to self determination at a future date, the current section 30 order process is anti democratic. I could be persuaded to put indy to the side for a while if we had that backstop and a clear process for exercising that right. Particularly if coupled with further devolution and a decentralisation process.

 

[southfieldhibby]

DUP will do a deal with the Tories for any minority Tory Government.

They’ll be as relevant as the Lib Dems on the 13th.

 

[1875]

In the way Boris will say no to any requests for a referendum. What's their strategy to overcome that. Personally I'd like to see them proceed with the referendum anyway....

Me too. I expect they will too.

 

[Smurf]

They’ll be as relevant as the Lib Dems on the 13th.

I'd like that. Sadly I fear not....

 

[Smurf]

It's looking increasingly likely that the Tories are going to romp home. How utterly depressing.

 

[GORDONSMITH7]

Johnson doesnt need to do feck all if the mrp poll is near right - prediction of tory majority of 68 including retaining 11 seats in Scotland - feck me

I was going to point out that the very same day every single right wing Tory supporting rag run this story on their front pages and MSM smacking their collective lip. The Telegraph, ***, the Daily Mail, Express, the Evening Standard, Sky News, the Metro etc,etc, however the very same rags did the same at the same point in campaign in 2017. Oops.

Harold Wilson famously said that a week is a long time in politics. Today one week late the Telegraph prostrates itself such.......

Boris Johnson's predicted Commons majority slashed from 80 to 12 in a week, poll of polls reveals

Charles Hymas
29 NOVEMBER 2019 • 8:40 PM
Boris Johnson has seen his projected Commons majority slashed from 80 to just 12 seats in a week as Jeremy Corbyn’s Labour party eats into the Conservatives’ lead, a poll of polls has revealed.

The survey - based on almost 10,000 voters - shows Jeremy Corbyn closing the gap on the Tories in the same way as Theresa May’s lead collapsed after her manifesto launch and her refusal to appear in TV debates.

BIG G

 

[Two Headed Boy]

I dont trust corbyn with the security and defence of the country.

I'm intruiged by this one because I see it a lot.

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you but I'd like to know what that opinion is based on. Is it just his anti-nuke stance or is it a worry about left-wingers in general?

As far as I have seen in my lifetime (82-present) there has been more domestic terrorism under Tory led governments than Labour ones?

 

[gun ainm]

interesting article on how Labour are sortof engaging in the constitutional question TRIBUNE, been so low key i have missed any discussion on that at all...

excerpt:

constitutional transformation that can provide the best opportunity to renew the party’s agenda over five years of hard lessons about the limitations of the British state. The Labour manifesto promises a ‘constitutional convention’, led by a Citizen’s Assembly, to explore how the redistribution of wealth and economic institutions across Britain can be accompanied by a redistribution of democratic power. Scottish Labour’s own manifesto offers further detail on this, calling for a UK-wide ‘charter of rights’ that could form the embryo of a written constitution. This could include a range of economic, social and political rights, from welfare provision to trade union freedoms, which no devolved nation or region of the UK could diminish.....The UK and Scottish manifestos both propose replacing the House of Lords with a ‘Senate of the Nations and Regions’ to oversee this ‘rebalancing’ of British intergovernmental relations, ending the ‘hierarchy’ of Westminster over everything else and embracing a principle of ‘co-determination.’

Yet these proposals remain extremely vague, and should Labour win, one urgent priority for Scottish Labour will be to ensure that they do not fall by the wayside in the excitement of a new government.

its all interesting but the key point for me iis about priority and commitment - a confidence and supply agreement could secure it? I'd very much like to see a public debate on this between unionists, confederalists and independistas. SLabour should really be banging the drum on this and it is odd that they havent been

 

[paigntonhibby]

I'm intruiged by this one because I see it a lot.

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you but I'd like to know what that opinion is based on. Is it just his anti-nuke stance or is it a worry about left-wingers in general?

As far as I have seen in my lifetime (82-present) there has been more domestic terrorism under Tory led governments than Labour ones?

Sorry , I cant remember which conference/ speech it was I saw but corbyn was talking about loss of jobs/ unemployment and he he said something along the lines the only thing he wants to see losing jobs is the military. Cannae remember exactly without spending time looking it up, age is a badtard

 

[paigntonhibby]

Sorry , I $%#@ remember which conference/ speech it was I saw but corbyn was talking about loss of jobs/ unemployment and he he said something along the lines the only thing he wants to see losing jobs is the military. Cannae remember exactly without spending time looking it up, age is a badtard

Dinnae think he has an anti nuke stance these days, but I'd like to see trident scrapped and some of the money put into building our conventional forces to a realistic level especially the navy which doesnt have enough ships to carry out its operational/ humanitarian duties now never mind being able to react if there's a threat

 

[Fernando]

A threat to Scotland or the uk ?we don't have enough to react to a poor fisherman trying to make a living oot in the sea's rescue vessel would leave fae doon south

 

[Chester Perry]

I note that you have expressed yourself as a Scottish Nationalist. Thank goodness the Nats I have known personally for many years on here and those that I have not have what you clearly have not, a sense of perspective. I salute these amigos.

BIG G

I’m apathetic. To life. You however have zero empathy to anyone. Fuck amigos.

 

[southfieldhibby]

I’m apathetic. To life. You however have zero empathy to anyone. Fuck amigos.

Is this Spanish friends with benefits?

 

[hibbybilly]

Boris Johnson opened his advent calendar this morning and discovered a *&*^ in number 10.

 

[moathibby]

If China moved into Afghanistan,I'd like to know how our navy would sort it out?Or would you seriously suggest we could nuke em?

 

[Westside Green]

If China moved into Afghanistan,I'd like to know how our navy would sort it out?Or would you seriously suggest we could nuke em?

No need the Afghans would do to them as they've done to all the other invaders.

 

[Jack]

If China moved into Afghanistan,I'd like to know how our navy would sort it out?Or would you seriously suggest we could nuke em?

I don't know why they don't put an aircraft carrier under London Bridge. That seems to be a hotspot for terrorism.

 

[1875]

I don't know why they don't put an aircraft carrier under London Bridge. That seems to be a hotspot for terrorism.

it wouldn’t fit.

 

[moathibby]

All I know is, right now I'd like to string John Ashworth up by his fucking bollocks.

 

[paigntonhibby]

If China moved into Afghanistan,I'd like to know how our navy would sort it out?Or would you seriously suggest we could nuke em?

What ?????

 

[Ryan69]

I've got friends who were born in Scotland, but now live in Australia and are Australian citizens, live in Holland and are dutch citizens

Im absolutely certain they dont class themselves as Australian or Dutch regardless of their citizenship.

So what is your point?

 

[Purple & Green]

Im absolutely certain they dont class themselves as Australian or Dutch regardless of their citizenship.

So what is your point?

They do identify as Australian and Dutch that was the point. I don’t think it’s as clear cut as you do.

 

[paigntonhibby]

We've got a couple of Dutch residents on here, if asked their nationality it would be interesting to know what they would answer ,as I said before my daughters an Australian citizen but when asked her nationality she says Scottish

 

[Weehibbydrew]

If it helps, I live in Musselburgh, but I still regard myself as a Leither. Left there in 1999.
Edit: I realise that probably doesn't help. 'Mon the Leith, though.

 

[Desperate Dan]

Swinson emptied

 

[Purple & Green]

Tony Blair only labour leader to win an election in nigh on 50 years

 

[broonieboy]

Tony Blair only labour leader to win an election in nigh on 50 years

Tells you all you need to know.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Jack]

Among all the fucked up fuckness in England, the constituency that has Grenfell in it went from Labour to the Torys!

What do these 14,000,000 people who voted Tory see that I can't?

 

[GORDONSMITH7]

Among all the fucked up fuckness in England, the constituency that has Grenfell in it went from Labour to the Torys!

Your analysis does not show the whole story Jack .
Kensington is on of the richest Constituencies in Britain, having Liz's Kensington palace, Foreign Embassies and the most expensive properties in Britain, Science Museum, Natural History Museum, V and A. On the other hand part of the Constituency has multiple deprivation and high density multi storey residence.
Always been Tory until 2017.
2010 Tory majority....8616 (Malcolm Rifkind)
2015 Tory majority....7361
2017 Labour majority.....20
2019 Tory majority.....150
Ex Tory party Cabinet minister jumper to the Lib Dems Sam Gyimah took 9312, well done Sam.

BIG G

 

[Jack]

Your analysis does not show the whole story Jack .
Kensington is on of the richest Constituencies in Britain, having Liz's Kensington palace, Foreign Embassies and the most expensive properties in Britain, Science Museum, Natural History Museum, V and A. On the other hand part of the Constituency has multiple deprivation and high density multi storey residence.
Always been Tory until 2017.
2010 Tory majority....8616 (Malcolm Rifkind)
2015 Tory majority....7361
2017 Labour majority.....20
2019 Tory majority.....150
Ex Tory party Cabinet minister jumper to the Lib Dems Sam Gyimah took 9312, well done Sam.

BIG G

To be fair Big G I knew some of that. But there's a string of toryness that came together to make Grenfell the disaster it was, not least the Boris effect on the London Fire Service while he was the Mayor!

I would have thought much of that would have struck home with the locals and it would have been a Labour hold.

 

[paigntonhibby]

What do these 14,000,000 people who voted Tory see that I can't?

Probably, given the choice between two totally unelectable pricks they thought, rightly or wrongly that Boris was the one likely to do least damage. Also Boris was unfortunately , the only one that was listening to th 17 million that voted to leave the EU

 

[bigmanandy]

I see the Tory knighthood list is utterly appalling as expected, murderers like IDS on it.

 

[Chester Perry]

I see the Tory knighthood list is utterly appalling as expected, murderers like IDS on it.

Brexit was about being ruled by unelected folk making rules, yet no complaint from them about the House of Lords. Wanks.