The clothes they wear? So a woman is what clothes they wear.
Makes sense I suppose. Do an Arnold Laine and you become a wummin?
Makes sense I suppose. Do an Arnold Laine and you become a wummin?
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Just stop oil protesters jailed
- Thread starter Archie
- Start date
Arnold Layne please.
From a fellow Pinko.
From a fellow Pinko.
I'm pissed Doc. On the third bottle of wine.
But I should have known that you'd know about snowdropping. Maybe.
But I should have known that you'd know about snowdropping. Maybe.
Findlayhibby
Private Member
I’m sorry but are Just Stop Oil protesters in the SNP ?and are trans activists?Im lost.
egb_hibs
Private Member
What is their message? Do they want to condemn millions, maybe billions to famine and death, billions more to poverty, plus spark a war or several, and reverse the fortunes of women and others? Perhaps they would like to see a return to feudalism and the restoration of their family seats to former grandeur? Or maybe they actually have a plan for getting rid of oil without returning us to the pre industrial era?I don't have a fixation on the clothes protestors wear. The importance of their message becomes more urgent every day. Brave people.
I suspect the adults are working on that in labs and policy forming bodies while permastudents, debutantes and hobbyists enjoy making a scene and getting in the way of ordinary people. I’d love them - or indeed you if you fancy a crack it - to explain to me what they are contributing even in the smallest way to addressing the climate issue.
Everybody wants to save the world, no one wants to help mom with the dishes.
Three bottles on a weekday is pretty decent, you'll be comfortably numb.I'm pissed Doc. On the third bottle of wine.
But I should have known that you'd know about snowdropping. Maybe.
Snowdropping isn't entirely familiar to me (or wasn't) but I know a Pink Floyd song when I hear it.
egb_hibs
Private Member
If it was happening regularly I think you’d find folk telling the golf to stick it G
But if nobody saves the world, won't be no mom to help.
egb_hibs
Private Member
But what are they doing to that end?
When did we slip into the idea that hashtags and performances help anything ? There is no awareness raising required, people are aware.
It’s engineers and scientists that will save us here.
That’s the point of the PJ O’Rourke quote ; focus on the good you can do.
Still true what I said. I'm the one who usually champions scientists but their credibility is under daft right wing populist threat now so they need folk on the barricades bringing the elephant in the room into view fir the coming generations.
Bossie
Private Member
It's dead simple. The 1.5-degree climate warming limit is only possible if we stop burning all fossil fuels. Whilst the UK contributes less than 1% of carbon emissions, it accounts for around 15% of funding for new hydrocarbon-based projects.
Working with international groups, Just Stop Oil wants our governments to commit to a legally binding international treaty to end the extraction and burning of oil, gas, and coal by 2030.
At a time when we are experiencing the hottest days in history and insufficient government action, Just Stop Oil's message must get through—they are one of the good guys.
egb_hibs
Private Member
What elephant in the room?
The elephant in the room as I see it is that if the vanities of these people were indulged the consequences would be as I set out. The only awareness left to raise is that of consequences. These guys seem a little less keen on that.
They are contributing nothing.
IYO. Time will tell. And the elephant in the room was obvs temperature rise due to huge use of fossil fuels everywhere.
I disagree in this matter of speculation but feel free to compulsively post yet another final word opinion. You just can't leave it at a diff of opinion, can you?
egb_hibs
Private Member
It's not an elephant in the room. Everyone knows about it.
Oh I could. I left off the whole thing for years and it wasn't difficult. But I'm not getting done by this rhetorical trick.
If you can't spell out what contribution these aristocratic blades are making then fine but just say so rather than this trickery. Noone will blame you because it's not a question that can be answered; they're contributing nothing.
Everyone knows its a problem and one that is very difficult to fix. If people want to contribute go get an engineering or physics degree and get their shoulder to the wheel rather than stroking their ego.
Bossie
Private Member
Over the decades, this has been the response to acts of civil disobedience by those in power and a vested interest in stopping change.
egb_hibs
Private Member
You have a go then Bossie;
What are these people contributing?
How do their actions advance, in the smallest way, a solution to climate challenges?
And if you don't like the above, are you asserting that it's wrong? If so please do expand because the world desperately needs to know if you have any answers others do not have.
You'll become extraordinarily wealthy too as capitalism is salivating over the prospect of such answers being available.
None of us on this forum were born yesterday. If we have fallen for the idea that you solve problems by virtue signalling then we do not have the excuses that teenagers do. What a world.
Bossie
Private Member
Just Stop Oil's proposed solution is for international governments to agree, by international treaty, to end the use of coal, oil, and gas.
Like all acts of civil disobedience, their actions advance the solution by highlighting the urgency of the looming climate catastrophe, and the lack of progress governments in relegating O&G interests.
I'm unclear why you view the climate catastrophe as an issue of virtue signalling. Who exactly is virtue signalling here, and what virtue is he/she signalling?
paigntonhibby
Private Member
They might as well go and sit outside the Chinese embassy and tell them to stop building coal fired power stations, because until they do nothing we do in this country will make a blind bit of difference.
Let's see how tolerant folk will be when they start losing their jobs, which is likely to happen in the Scottish oil industry with starmer blocking drilling permits
Let's see how tolerant folk will be when they start losing their jobs, which is likely to happen in the Scottish oil industry with starmer blocking drilling permits
Bossie
Private Member
This type of response is exactly why Just Stop Oil need to keep ploughing on.
For example, the UK disproportionately funds new hydrocarbon ventures. For example, It is a delusion to believe that the world’s climate is being pushed to the brink solely by the undemocratic petrostates. The truth is that about half of all planned oil and gas developments between now and 2050 will be sanctioned by wealthy governments that position themselves as climate leaders: the US, Canada, Australia, Norway and the UK.
Many oilfield personnel from this country are working in Africa etc nowadays. Countries like Nigeria, Cameroon, South Africa and Namibia are now being exploited by the same companies who built our oil industry and they can produce it more cheaply than UK. Starmer says he’s going to employ all the oilfield personnel in the renewables industry - a clear indication that he knows zip about the oilfield.
egb_hibs
Private Member
It is virtue signalling to prance about making a noise on an issue everyone is aware of while proposing glib and substance less answers.
If they are willing to say they believe the impoverishment or death of billions is required for...reasons...then I could at least grant them some coherence.
I don't think they would though, so basically they are smug overgrown kids behaving like kids and demanding some paternal authority magics up a solution.
As I say, if they want to help, get to work on solutions. I'm sure they're not all permanent work avoiders.
egb_hibs
Private Member
And this is the sort of response that betrays no serious engagement with the issue.
We don't eat oil, or wear it, get cured of sickness by it etc.
Oil is just fuel that powers food production, transport, manufacture, heating and cooling, media, medicine production and healthcare services. The list obviously goes on.
Any serious argument is about how these things get powered in alternative ways or how we dispense with them and address the consequences of that. On top of that, the lifestyle choices they enable. Or just lives, full stop.
Once just stop oil are willing to grasp this nettle they'll maybe be worth listening to.
Bossie
Private Member
Right so you're generalising about the they's. Fair enough.
egb_hibs
Private Member
If you can point me to where JSTO stance has differed from my characterisation I will concede its a generalisation. For example addressing anything outlined in post #103 perhaps?
paigntonhibby
Private Member
You’ve got Russia bombing fuck out of Ukraine, china close to invading Taiwan.a fuckin lunatic likely to become president of americky, Israel bombing shit out of Gaza, hamas not giving a fuck, Saudi Arabia and Iran backing different sides in Yemen, everything else going on in Somalia and Ethiopia, India and Pakistan never a baw hair away fae battering fuck out of each other, a dozen different civil wars in Africa and you think some middle class scroat climbing a motorway gantry creating fuckin chaos is gonna get them all together and talk about oil,gas and coal??? Really ???
Bossie
Private Member
You don't need to be an expert in future power and energy networks and systems to practice civil disobedience regarding the looming climate catastrophe. Just like you don't need to be an expert in future power and energy networks and systems to dismiss the laudable objectives of those who choose to disobey.
Clearly, the organisations that should be grasping your nettle are the multinational O&G corporations, and it would be a cause for optimism if they were directing their massive resources to help save the planet. Unfortunately, while they continue to find ways to open up new oil and gas fields, they have chosen to opt out of the global effort to transition to renewable energy. These are the bad guys, not the tiny activist groups that are your selected victims in this tragedy.
Bossie
Private Member
You’ve got Russia bombing fuck out of Ukraine, china close to invading Taiwan.a fuckin lunatic likely to become president of americky, Israel bombing shit out of Gaza, hamas not giving a fuck, Saudi Arabia and Iran backing different sides in Yemen, everything else going on in Somalia and Ethiopia, India and Pakistan never a baw hair away fae battering fuck out of each other, a dozen different civil wars in Africa and you think that the bad guys are some middle class scroat climbing a motorway gantry?? Really ???
paigntonhibby
Private Member
I’m thinking that middle class scroat can climb every motorway gantry in the UK and piss the whole country off and it won’t make the slightest bit of difference to any of those countries I’ve mentioned, or most of the ones I haven’t.
We can all take to pushbikes tomorrow, shut down our oil and gas production and close all all our gas and coal fired power stations and countries like china will not give one iota of a fuck making his annoying gesture entirely futile.
Only govts can change things not joe blogs lying dying in an ambulance on the m25 cause some prat’s sitting on a fuckin gantry.
egb_hibs
Private Member
I suspect the people that do these kind of things don't take brown people very seriously. I expect that while they wouldn't voice it, perhaps not even to themselves, they expect whitey will sort this out.
Bossie
Private Member
Yup, and the middle-class scroat is campaigning for exactly the issue you highlight - only governments can change things. That's why the Just Stop Oil middle-class scroat is campaigning for governments to commit to a legally binding international treaty to end the extraction and burning of oil gas and coal by 2030. If we all sign up, and demonstrate the urgency for change, we won't need middle-class scroats to go sit on a motorway fuckin gantry.
Bossie
Private Member
Is that another broad generalisation, or is it grounded in evidence and facts?
paigntonhibby
Private Member
There you go again, thinking countries that are bombing fuck out of each other give a toss about some prick on a gantry and will stop hostilities and sign treaties immediately to keep our motorways open
These Just Stop Oil folks are end of times cultists.
Indigo Rumbelow ffs. What else could be expected of her.
Here's another loony from Just Stop Oil
These are irrational people. You cannot reason with them.
Indigo Rumbelow ffs. What else could be expected of her.
Here's another loony from Just Stop Oil
These are irrational people. You cannot reason with them.
egb_hibs
Private Member
even the language here is telling. Ooh ‘civil disobedience’.
Bossie, when these people have no concrete demand that anyone can respond to, when their demands if ‘just met’ would pretty much definitely kill or impoverish as many or more as would the most speculative climate change scenario, when they are not raising awareness of anything because everyone is already aware…
Civil disobedience has a worthwhile purpose in the context of, say, the civil rights movements of yore; a worthwhile cause where action might influence proceedings. Even the whoppers determined to see all ‘Zionists’ wiped out, are actually doing their thing in respect of something that again, can be influenced. There is nothing at all that can be done, even in theory, as a consequence of JSTO, at least without pulverising half the people on earth. There is literally no point to their shenanigans apart from a masturbatory jamboree of self gratification.
What are they contributing? At best they are misleading the ill informed and suggestible that this is ‘easy’ at worst they are proposing mega slaughter.
That’s not true at all. As I pointed out, oil and gas are hee haw on their own. They are fuels for things which need replacement fuels or we do without them. Were you delighted at recent energy cost hikes? Or were you complaining, or supporting complainants of that? That was a mere wrinkle in the fabric of energy supply. What do you expect if it all disappears ?
That. Is. The. Challenge.
Constructive people are working their tails off to do that. This collection of swampies and aristocrats are doing fuck all but disrupting people that actually need to work for a living.
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egb_hibs
Private Member
It’s grounded in my observation of these characters time and time again. Why not prove me wrong and give me any reason at all to believe these characters can at the same time be a) serious in their intent and b) have a basic awareness of the world as somewhat robustly set out by Paignton in post #108 and c) take the protagonists in that even vaguely seriously
That alone raises my suspicions. Tbh though id be somewhat astonished if these people aren’t omnicausers, and that portfolio amply demonstrates my point.
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Pretty crap attempt at a barrier tbh.
Folk just stepped over them, then they got lifted.
I think I may have been tempted to just clip one of them with my knee as I stepped over.
….all of it. By 2030.
Which is demonstrably and obviously impossible. It’s not remotely plausible.
When I watched the clips of the dafties blocking passengers I wondered why no one had smacked them in the face.
Or tripped holding a cup of hot coffee.
Saying that I think it would be a certainty that whoever hit a daftie with a suitcase would get carted by the bizzies.
Or tripped holding a cup of hot coffee.
Saying that I think it would be a certainty that whoever hit a daftie with a suitcase would get carted by the bizzies.