Hecky thought Scottish football was crap

[AG1337]

59 goals in 108 appearances shows he knows where the goals are , ok its at a lower level but its still putting the ball in the net . Lower standard of opposition but lower standard of team mates too . I reckon if he can get a couple he might just do quite well for us

I think that’s a fair conclusion, I live in hope too ??

 

[Hattie]

If we had their money, we would, 100%. Look at Swansea, for instance. No way they’re bigger than Hibs (and I’ve followed the Jacks for a few years when I lived down south).


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Wigan, Burnley....

 

[Hattie]

Regardless of all the debating ie size etc...one thing is for sure..Heckingbottom was totally useless and out his depth ??

 

[Forzahibs]

Wigan, Burnley....

I'd say Burney have had their moments over the years but again if it's only down to money when don't Newcastle do better ? A far bigger club than Hibs , why have Liverpool never won't the epl, why did man city need a mega rich sheikh to get them anywhere ? Why are Ipswich currently in the 3rd tier ?

 

[1875]

Off topic but is it hard to get Everton home tickets? Might go to their game against Villa towards end of season

Yes, they sell out but happy to help.

 

[Hattie]

I'd say Burney have had their moments over the years but again if it's only down to money when don't Newcastle do better ? A far bigger club than Hibs , why have Liverpool never won't the epl, why did man city need a mega rich sheikh to get them anywhere ? Why are Ipswich currently in the 3rd tier ?

You are quite correct in all you say.. it doesn’t actually fall into any reasoning. One thing it does show, with the right input and ambition.. you can go places

 

[Smurf]

59 goals in 108 appearances shows he knows where the goals are , ok its at a lower level but its still putting the ball in the net . Lower standard of opposition but lower standard of team mates too . I reckon if he can get a couple he might just do quite well for us

The club are very confident he will come good.

 

[Forzahibs]

You are quite correct in all you say.. it doesn’t actually fall into any reasoning. One thing it does show, with the right input and ambition.. you can go places

There always seems to be a premier team that goes down and instead of coming back up they go down again. Looks like it could be stoke this season , man city , Leeds Ipswich, some pretty big names have played in what I still call the 3rd division

 

[Green juventine]

The club are very confident he will come good.

Hope they are right. So am I right in saying he played the lone striker down there as well and if he did what kind of service and what kind of goals I.e headers, tap ins, poachers goals inside the box.
He got plenty of service at Hibs but nearly all were high balls played directly at him which to me looked like it suited him.
Never recall many balls played over him for him to make any diagonal runs onto that's why I'm curious as to what kind of goals he scored.
I don't rate him at the moment on what I've seen but if he's scored that many goals it could be and hopefully was Heckingbottom system that didn't suit him. Hears hoping we see an improvement.

 

[Green juventine]

Hope they are right. So am I right in saying he played the lone striker down there as well and if he did what kind of service and what kind of goals I.e headers, tap ins, poachers goals inside the box.
He got plenty of service at Hibs but nearly all were high balls played directly at him which to me looked like it suited him.
Never recall many balls played over him for him to make any diagonal runs onto that's why I'm curious as to what kind of goals he scored.
I don't rate him at the moment on what I've seen but if he's scored that many goals it could be and hopefully was Heckingbottom system that didn't suit him. Hears hoping we see an improvement.

Sorry meant to say high balls played directly at him DIDN'T suit him.

 

[Hattie]

There always seems to be a premier team that goes down and instead of coming back up they go down again. Looks like it could be stoke this season , man city , Leeds Ipswich, some pretty big names have played in what I still call the 3rd division

Sunderland another classic example, in a shambles with easily 40k crowds every home game. Shows how much damage mismanagement can do

 

[Smurf]

Hope they are right. So am I right in saying he played the lone striker down there as well and if he did what kind of service and what kind of goals I.e headers, tap ins, poachers goals inside the box.
He got plenty of service at Hibs but nearly all were high balls played directly at him which to me looked like it suited him.
Never recall many balls played over him for him to make any diagonal runs onto that's why I'm curious as to what kind of goals he scored.
I don't rate him at the moment on what I've seen but if he's scored that many goals it could be and hopefully was Heckingbottom system that didn't suit him. Hears hoping we see an improvement.

He was originally a target of Neil Lennon when at Hibs. I've not seen enough to suggest he will come good. Hopefully the next manager can get the best out of him.

 

[Green juventine]

?

 

[tricky]

Hope they are right. So am I right in saying he played the lone striker down there as well and if he did what kind of service and what kind of goals I.e headers, tap ins, poachers goals inside the box.
He got plenty of service at Hibs but nearly all were high balls played directly at him which to me looked like it suited him.
Never recall many balls played over him for him to make any diagonal runs onto that's why I'm curious as to what kind of goals he scored.
I don't rate him at the moment on what I've seen but if he's scored that many goals it could be and hopefully was Heckingbottom system that didn't suit him. Hears hoping we see an improvement.

Scored a cracker at Wembley in play off v Tranmere from outside box, not seen any others but was quite prolific as Forza said

 

[Green juventine]

Scored a cracker at Wembley in play off v Tranmere from outside box, not seen any others but was quite prolific as Forza said

There is hope then.

 

[tayside hibee]

I'm not surprised in the slightest that Heckingbottom underestimated the type of player required to play in our league. He underestimated the whole club and task. His comments about the fans putting too much pressure on his lambs while we were being held to a draw, at home to the mighty St Johnstone was an indication . His arrogant comment about the fans reaction when he subbed Scott Allan , told us all that he thought we were idiots. His persistence with one up front ( and a donkey at that) and replacing a consistent international goalie with a spice boy made me doubt he even wanted to keep his job.
He reduced the effectiveness of Scott Allan ,and generally robbed the team of any confidence. He hasn't even got close to knowing what his best 11 was, a quarter into the season.
His signings are pishier than pish . I really don't see that changing.

We must move on, what's done is done

 

[vasco de gama]

There always seems to be a premier team that goes down and instead of coming back up they go down again. Looks like it could be stoke this season , man city , Leeds Ipswich, some pretty big names have played in what I still call the 3rd division

Ipswich success was pretty much down to Bobby Robson. It’s not a particulary big town. They have found their true place. Stoke ain’t massive either. Leeds is massive but simply never recovered from their bankruptcy. Eventually Leeds will rise to the level of Everton.

 

[Forzahibs]

Ipswich success was pretty much down to Bobby Robson. It’s not a particulary big town. They have found their true place. Stoke ain’t massive either. Leeds is massive but simply never recovered from their bankruptcy. Eventually Leeds will rise to the level of Everton.

not talking about the size of towns but clubs that were in the top league and winners in Europe (Ipswich) and teams you'd fancy to bounce back rather than drop down again . Someone else pointed out Sunderland are another

 

[Weehibbydrew]

Ipswich success was pretty much down to Bobby Robson. It’s not a particulary big town. They have found their true place. Stoke ain’t massive either. Leeds is massive but simply never recovered from their bankruptcy. Eventually Leeds will rise to the level of Everton.

Ipswich won the league 20 years before Robson under Alf Ramsey iirc.

 

[beefy]

Hope they are right. So am I right in saying he played the lone striker down there as well and if he did what kind of service and what kind of goals I.e headers, tap ins, poachers goals inside the box.
He got plenty of service at Hibs but nearly all were high balls played directly at him which to me looked like it suited him.
Never recall many balls played over him for him to make any diagonal runs onto that's why I'm curious as to what kind of goals he scored.
I don't rate him at the moment on what I've seen but if he's scored that many goals it could be and hopefully was Heckingbottom system that didn't suit him. Hears hoping we see an improvement.

http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.c...stian-doidge-prolific-striker-hibs-641739?amp

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[Purple & Green]

http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.c...stian-doidge-prolific-striker-hibs-641739?amp

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[Two Headed Boy]

http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.c...stian-doidge-prolific-striker-hibs-641739?amp

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I remember reading that at the time. Set up tap-ins for him was the gist of it.

Top insight.

 

[beefy]

View attachment 1594

Strange [emoji848] it works for me.

Here's what it said...

The Easter Road club bought the 27-year-old Welshman for a six-figure transfer fee from Forest Green Rovers in June after he scored 66 goals in less than three seasons with the Gloucestershire club.

Manager Paul Heckingbottom declared at the time that Hibs had made “a real statement of intent” by landing the striker on a three-year deal. However, Doidge has 
had an underwhelming start to his Easter Road career since joining, scoring just two goals against lower-league opponents in the Betfred Cup and then starting only two of his team’s five league games so far.

With Hibs struggling for goals in recent games, there is every chance Doidge will be pitched back into the starting line up in the coming weeks.

Forest Green manager Mark Cooper, who worked with Doidge in each of the past three seasons, aside from his four-month loan stint at Bolton Wanderers last year, is adamant his team’s former talisman will soon start delivering for the club.

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“Christian was fantastic in his time with us,” Cooper told the Evening News.

“He scored a lot of goals and got a great move to Bolton which turned sour. He did brilliantly for us though. He helped get us promoted out of the National League, helped keep us up and continued to score goals regardless or whether we were playing well or not. I think if he’s played in the right way, he’ll always score goals.”

Cooper explained that the best way to get Doidge scoring is to allow him to remain high up the pitch and not to ask him to become embroiled in general build-up play.

“It’s not for me to tell Paul Heckingbottom how to play him but we played him predominantly as a No. 9 up on his own,” said Cooper. “He can play with a partner but he’s always got to be the one closest to goal.

“We played with a No. 10 behind him and all we used to work on with Christian was getting him to run towards goal and not to get involved in too much of the hold-up play.

“We wanted him to stay as close to the goal as possible. We had good players behind him and we served him up a lot of good chances. We didn’t want Christian playing outside the width of the box.”

Cooper insists there is more to his game than knocking in tap-ins, and referenced his brilliant strike against Tranmere Rovers in the 2017 Vanarama National League play-off final as evidence. “He’s not just a poacher - he scored all sorts of goals for us,” said Cooper.

“Look at his goal for us in the play-off final at Wembley where he cut inside and curled it into the corner from about 20 yards. It’s just a case of providing him with opportunities.

“Ideally you want to keep him within the width of the goalposts and have people supplying him.

Cooper dismissed the suggestion that the perceived step up from League Two in England to the Scottish Premiership may have caught Doidge out. “There are a lot of League Two teams who could compete in the Scottish Premiership,” he said.

“I believe Christian will get goals in the Scottish Premiership if he gets the right service. I think he’ll do great at Hibs. He’s a great professional who works his socks off. If he can get himself on a run, he’ll score a lot of goals.”



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[Desperate Dan]

Best way tae get him tae score loads of goals is tae play him at his level, lets say the english conference for instance.

 

[Hibees-Mad]

From Aidan Smith's piece in the Scotsman:

I Iaughed when Heckingbottom told me a story from last season about a supporter behind the dugout imploring him to make a tactical change. This had been in his mind, he said, but he held off, not wanting the fellow going away bragging at having influenced the manager’s thinking


Says everything I need to know about the arrogant prick. Fuck um

Aidan Smith: Poor signings put a spoke in Heckingbottom’s wheel of misfortune

You’ve got to feel sorry for the staff in the club shop. I mean, what are they going to do with all those unsold “Hecky at the wheel” T-shirts?

www.scotsman.com

 

[vasco de gama]

Ipswich won the league 20 years before Robson under Alf Ramsey iirc.

I just looked that up and you are sort of corr3ct (it was 8 years before Robson). Ramsey brought them up from the 3rd division so again I’d suggest it was a case of a two great managers taking a very average side to the top. Point though is that Hibs should be a permanent fixture in the EPL if they were admitted. As should Aberdeen, The Guntz, and the Uglies (who I think would win it within 10 years). The rest would be like teams such as Ipswich. Occasionally rising into the top league but struggling to maintain their place. We’d never have to appoint someone like Heckingbottom or Calderwood ever again.

 

[Forzahibs]

I just looked that up and you are sort of corr3ct (it was 8 years before Robson). Ramsey brought them up from the 3rd division so again I’d suggest it was a case of a two great managers taking a very average side to the top. Point though is that Hibs should be a permanent fixture in the EPL if they were admitted. As should Aberdeen, The Guntz, and the Uglies (who I think would win it within 10 years). The rest would be like teams such as Ipswich. Occasionally rising into the top league but struggling to maintain their place. We’d never have to appoint someone like Heckingbottom or Calderwood ever again.

As a matter of interest, what do you base the last part on ?

 

[Canon Hannan]

Thing is Hibs played 20 league games last year against Celtic, Sevco, Dons, Gunts and Killie in the top 6. SPL teams in Scotland play in Europe (ok mostly struggle) and big games at Hampden regularly but that's all lower league one standard....The guy was an arrogant, ignorant fud and showed have been out the door weeks ago!

 

[Callumnapier]

Surely to fuck he didn't say that at his interview?

I know he wouldn’t have but surely they’d ask him what he knows about Scottish football etc. And actually question the guy

 

[beefy]

Aidan Smith's article shows you the type of man Hecky is. Here's a snippet...

"I laughed when Heckingbottom told me a story from last season about a supporter behind the dugout imploring him to make a tactical change. This had been in his mind, he said, but he held off, not wanting the fellow going away bragging at having influenced the manager’s thinking. "

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[beefy]

Here's the linky...

Aidan Smith: Poor signings put a spoke in Heckingbottom’s wheel of misfortune

You’ve got to feel sorry for the staff in the club shop. I mean, what are they going to do with all those unsold “Hecky at the wheel” T-shirts?

www.scotsman.com

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[vasco de gama]

As a matter of interest, what do you base the last part on ?

I’m saying we’d basically be a ‘big club’ constantly receiving the megabucks from Sky or whoever it is. So we would never be needing an inexperienced cheapies option as a manager.

 

[Keithd1875]

So doidge scored 59 goals in 108 games in a shite league down south - what's Oli Shaw's goals to starts ratio? Wouldn't be much worse than that i would have thought? He also gets into a lot more scoring positions too - granted he misses a lot but I'd rather go with him than doidge.

 

[Doc Shrink]

So doidge scored 59 goals in 108 games in a shite league down south - what's Oli Shaw's goals to starts ratio? Wouldn't be much worse than that i would have thought? He also gets into a lot more scoring positions too - granted he misses a lot but I'd rather go with him than doidge.

Doidge has a physical presence that Oli lacks. Perhaps a Doidge/Flo start, with Oli replacing him if it doesn’t bring success?

 

[Bobby_Combe]

Here's the linky...

Aidan Smith: Poor signings put a spoke in Heckingbottom’s wheel of misfortune

You’ve got to feel sorry for the staff in the club shop. I mean, what are they going to do with all those unsold “Hecky at the wheel” T-shirts?

www.scotsman.com

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Shred 'em.

Example: he had ample time to assess the capabilities of Bartley and Milligan in midfield. He chose not to renew either of their contracts, and brought in a slew of League One and League Two replacements, none of whom are in any way adequate to the task.

Right now we're back where we were when Butcher was at ER - no motivation, no effort, no sweat, and the remaining talented players pissed-off by the treatment they've been receiving.

Paul, FYI -"Having a degree" in whatever doesn't mean you know anything useful about the subject; you're probably nothing more than an idiot who can keep on the right side of your teachers and pass the exams.

 

[Sheldrake07]

English manager comes to Scotland with pre conceived ideas that the league is crap is right up there with "Do bears sh#t in the woods".

Contempt for Scottish football would be deep in his physche and his stubborn personality wouldn't allow his brain to see what his eyes were telling him week after week.

I am just surprised he didn't make a comment like "Its like a different country up here" given so many English people (and Scottish people for that matter) regard Scotland as an extension of England.

Teams like Hibs, Gunts and Aberdeen would you yo yo between top of league 1 and the English Championship where they would rarely last long though there are plenty examples of similar sized clubs to suggest on occasions they just might.

PHB didn't fail because of his pre conceived ideas though.

He failed in his recruitment obviously but crucially he failed due to his reluctance to play his better players ahead of his duds, he didn't rate the younger players, tactically he seemed to be boxed into a one striker policy for every game and most surprisingly he didn't seem to understand the neccesity of a central defensive midfield lynchpin.

He has been very well paid for his failure and should be able to con his way back onto the gravy train sometime in the future.

The bit in bold assumes that SPL teams would keep their income static as it is now, without their income it would be difficult; with it good Scottish teams would be minimum of top half of Championship.

Your penultimate paragraph nails it for me..

I confess i was pleased at his appointment on the strength of what he said so cannot blame anyone for his appointment. I wanted him away though after the first game of the season, you could see where it was going from that. He gone, later than i would have wished but thank god he has gone.

Onwards and upwards!

 

[HenryLB]

I’m saying we’d basically be a ‘big club’ constantly receiving the megabucks from Sky or whoever it is. So we would never be needing an inexperienced cheapies option as a manager.

Agree with your second point but there's loads of clubs as big as Hibs or of comparable size outside the EPL. The top dozen or so Championship clubs all have higher attendances than us and there are even a few in League One that are bigger or arguably similar in size.

If the leagues merged, within a decade I'd expect Hibs to be a decent size Championship club with forays into the top tier.

 

[Johnny Kash]

Agree with your second point but there's loads of clubs as big as Hibs or of comparable size outside the EPL. The top dozen or so Championship clubs all have higher attendances than us and there are even a few in League One that are bigger or arguably similar in size.

If the leagues merged, within a decade I'd expect Hibs to be a decent size Championship club with forays into the top tier.

Solid Championship about our level. Of course were bigger than Watford or Bournemouth....

But were also smaller than Leeds, Sheff Weds and Sunderland (at least attendance wise). First two have been toiling for years to get into the EPL despite huge followings home and away.

 

[HenryLB]

Solid Championship about our level. Of course were bigger than Watford or Bournemouth....

But were also smaller than Leeds, Sheff Weds and Sunderland (at least attendance wise). First two have been toiling for years to get into the EPL despite huge followings home and away.

Bristol is a good comparison. It's a slightly bigger city than Edinburgh and it hosts two clubs, although I'd say it's a bit less of a footballing region by heritage.

City get about 21k to home games and Rovers around 8.5k. I'd hope to see City in the EPL inside a few years, and they have a chance, but there's loads of competition - maybe people underestimate how many English clubs there are with attendances between about 18 and 28k. It's quite a few. And there's loads more who would jump up to there if they got their act together - QPR, Bolton etc.

Something that's often forgotten is that the 'dividend' that Scottish entrants would get upon entry to a UK league (TV money etc) is one that's already enjoyed by similar clubs in England with whom we'd be competing. I've mentioned this on here before - City are a similar size to hibs but they spent something like 29 million in the summer. We'd get more money but we'd need to spend an awful lot more just to eature in the upper echelon of the Championship.

 

[Johnny Kash]

Bristol is a good comparison. It's a slightly bigger city than Edinburgh and it hosts two clubs, although I'd say it's a bit less of a footballing region by heritage.

City get about 21k to home games and Rovers around 8.5k. I'd hope to see City in the EPL inside a few years, and they have a chance, but there's loads of competition - maybe people underestimate how many English clubs there are with attendances between about 18 and 28k. It's quite a few. And there's loads more who would jump up to there if they got their act together - QPR, Bolton etc.

Something that's often forgotten is that the 'dividend' that Scottish entrants would get upon entry to a UK league (TV money etc) is one that's already enjoyed by similar clubs in England with whom we'd be competing. I've mentioned this on here before - City are a similar size to hibs but they spent something like 29 million in the summer. We'd get more money but we'd need to spend an awful lot more just to eature in the upper echelon of the Championship.

Bristol City are truly one of the most underachieving clubs in England in terms of potential. Rovers could also support an EPL side if they ever got up there. Surprised an Arab sheikh hasn't looked at taking over one of the brizzle clubs. Plymouth Argyle are another, must be something about the SouthWest.

Theres others floating around the lower leagues such as Bradford City and Notts County (whove even dropped into non league), with stadium capacity and home attendances not a million miles from ours.