Gray Yer Times Up

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Greenmachine said:
We didn't lose that game today because David Gray played a "weakened team".
The players selected should have been able to beat Dunfermline Athletic...a mid table scottish championship team...in a one-off cup tie.
Unfortunately too many of them are just not up to dealing with a highly competitive cup-tie in Scotland.
Far too many of our players went into hiding today, not for the first time, and let the fans and the manager down big time.

IMO standards have fallen since last season.
I'm not convinced by the feeling of many that Hibs have a very good squad and that the manager is just not getting the best out of them.
When do players start to take responsibility ? They are the ones that have to go out there and do the job they are very well paid to do.
I think our squad has been left ridiculously light up top, and I think there are a few of our players who are overhyped as well.
We do have some good players, but not as many as a lot of fans seem to think.

I'm beginning to wonder about the quality of our recruitment now.
Too many overseas players from far flung places and English lower league scufflers who just cannot adjust to scottish football and it's demands.
Hibs have had this recruitment model for years now....and I now think we need to seriously think about changing it.

We have to now put all our efforts into trying to finish as high up the league as we can, and go for fourth place and possibly Europe again.
End of the season should not only see a serious review of the season passed, but just where we want to be as a club, and how we intend to get there.
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Don't think it was anything to do with "going into hiding". Newell played as he always plays. We've moved our midfield on from him. He should be offloaded. We lost Mulligan's drive when he had to go off. We improved somewhat once Barlaser came on, but he should have started. All of that is down to SDG's decisions.
Why was there any justification in a traditional potential banana skin cup tie for not starting our strongest 11? Unfortunately Megwa regularly created problems with badly misdirected passes.
I'm sure SDG is well paid for what he does. But for some time our performances have been deteriorating, and he has to accept responsibility.
 
lenthehibby said:
Don't think it was anything to do with "going into hiding". Newell played as he always plays. We've moved our midfield on from him. He should be offloaded. We lost Mulligan's drive when he had to go off. We improved somewhat once Barlaser came on, but he should have started. All of that is down to SDG's decisions.
Why was there any justification in a traditional potential banana skin cup tie for not starting our strongest 11? Unfortunately Megwa regularly created problems with badly misdirected passes.
I'm sure SDG is well paid for what he does. But for some time our performances have been deteriorating, and he has to accept responsibility.
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We lost a goal too
 
The Family said:
Robinson at St Mirren for me.
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Maybe. His team aren't doing great of late and didn't think some of his comments during the week were very good about his team. Wouldn't want us having another JC player rebellion breaking out.
 
Somebody else described Gray's approach as percentage football and that sums us up I think. Most of us are bored watching it and it's also ceased to be effective. If he had shown any willingness to experiment and adapt as many of us have been calling for then he'd have more support but unfortunately he has proven unwilling or unable to do so. Time to move on, sadly.

From what I've seen Robinson's teams are always pretty big and the football is of the industrial variety. I don't want to watch that. We're not getting the Motherwell manager but his style is more suited to us I reckon.
 
I don't get why managers rotate their starting eleven for one off cup ties, the only competitions we can realistically win. If you want to make changes do it in the league FFS, also we've not had a game for a week and there isn't a game for another week who exactly needed rested? I've been saying for about a year I dread the day joe Newell is fit again and here we are
 
Keithd1875 said:
I don't get why managers rotate their starting eleven for one off cup ties, the only competitions we can realistically win. If you want to make changes do it in the league FFS, also we've not had a game for a week and there isn't a game for another week who exactly needed rested? I've been saying for about a year I dread the day joe Newell is fit again and here we are
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Hearts play strongest team available tonight. Doesn't guarantee a win but not fucking about.
 
I've skimmed through this thread rather than read every post (too painful) so apologies if I say something that's already been said.
My tuppence worth is this: I love SDG for his contribution to Hibernian over the years he's been here - and I've never once had cause to question his effort and commitment to do his absolute best in whatever role he was in at the Club.

BUT.....

I think his time is up.

Not just because he played a weakened team today in a must win game.
Not because our only tactic seems to be to play the ball between goalie and defence before launching an aimless 50 yard punt up the park.
Not because he has a team of pointers who always demand that the ball is passed to any teammate but them.
Not because of......add your own reasons.

My main gripe is that I can't actually remember the last great game of football I saw us play!

Great results? Yeah a few.

Entertainment - absolutely fuckin zero.

I can check results online for free - I pay hundreds of £££s each year to watch decent fitba.

I've seen fuck all from his teams 😭
 
I’m still devastated about today’s result. I was extremely annoyed at being put out last season by Kelty Hearts and one would think that was a learning moment but naw, here we are again, dumped out one of the few competitions where we can have a run at winning by another lower league team. ffs.
 
Kelty Puddledrinkers won but they didn't ever knock Hibs out of any cup though Celtc did twice last season as did "Scotland's Shame 2012" this season. 😢.

SDG didnae learn though and nothing was broken after the last excellent 3 results so nothing needed to be fixed but these managers just cannae help himself with their desire to play the big man and tinker about with a winning formula.

The time to do that is when you are drawn at home and go 2:0 up and not on a live TV match against a very tricky side away from home in the Scottish Cup. 😢.

Today Newell and Hoilet brought little to the table and SDG didn't help himself much keeping the awful Klidge and the distracted Bowie on the pitch for so long and this highlights one of his biggest problems as a manager in that he really doesn't think to well on his feet in the rough and tumble of the last 25 minutes.🤔

It's hardly a sacking offence though and he has plenty of credit in the bank after last year but he has to regain momentum for the rest of the season as 4th is still possible but so is 7th.😬
 
I am as disappointed as everyone else with today's result but that result was entirely down to the players on the park. ANY Hibs team should have been able to beat that opposition. But our season is far from over as we have two objectives now.
First, we must qualify for Europe again and I believe we can.
Second, we must ensure the Jamboes do NOT win the League this season because of the amount of points they took off Hibs. At the moment it's one (it's 3, my mistake, and why I was never a sums teacher) and so we have to win the remaining derbies, as Sir Albert has retired.
In Sir David we trust.
 
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Falkirk were well in the game at half time but McGlynn still made 3 subs to affect the game Great management. Falkirk were brilliant.
 
I'm not for sacking Gray just yet . He basically has the rest of the season to show he's not 'one dimetional ' in his mindset.

If we fail to qualify for Europe then he will probably know deep down it's over.

On the outside looking in from my point of view - There appears to be some nepotism with squad selections. If I was a player on the fringes of being selected and felt this way, then it could have serious consequences for the overall confidence and continuity of the squad.

Kildge confidence looks shattered. Not the same player I saw at the start of the season. Why is this? I could say the same for Chaiwa. How must he be feeling knowing a guy who's been out for 18 months gets a start over him?

Gray needs to give himself a long hard stare into the mirror and possibly accept his own mistakes (footballing wise) may be to the detriment of the overall squad.

He may then realize that being open to adapting new ideas isn't a sign of weakness or failure. It's quite the opposite really.

I hope /🙏 it works out and he learns from this.

Being stubborn in football management will only get you so far nowadays!
 
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Mr Hibs said:
I'm not for sacking Gray just yet . He basically has the rest of the season to show he's not 'one dimetional ' in his mindset.

If we fail to qualify for Europe then he will probably know deep down it's over.

On the outside looking in from my point of view - Their appears to be some nepotism with squad selections. If I was a player on the fringes of being selected and felt this way, then it could have serious consequences for the overall confidence and continuity of the squad.

Kildge confidence looks shattered. Not the same player I saw at the start of the season. Why is this? I could say the same for Chaiwa. How must he be feeling knowing a guy who's been out for 18 months gets a start over him?

Gray needs to give himself a long hard stare into the mirror and possibly accept his own mistakes (footballing wise) may be to the detriment of the overall squad.

He may then realize that being open to adapting new ideas isn't a sign of weakness or failure. It's quite the opposite really.

I hope /🙏 it works out and he learns from this.

Being stubborn in football management will only get you so far nowadays!
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Good points. Having one formation you don't change from no matter who the opposition are seems like fucking madness to me but I'm just a fan what would I know.
 
We are having the same discussions every few weeks now, same issues and same frustrations.

A great run last season for me isn't now a reason to think he can turn it, for me it's a reason to ask what happened?

We will not win anything with DG nor will we be relegated, we will float around where we are and if the club are happy with that then so be it.

I'm not.
 
I also look at how we have approached our games Vs the Old Firm.

We have gone into those matches as if they were the OF of the early 2000s. We haven't been close and it's been stand back and admire.

Im betting if Nancy was in charge of Celtic they would take points off us. The league cup game Vs Rangers was very frustrating.

I think DG gets it wrong too often.
 
SlovSam said:
It's hardly a sacking offence though
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So what would be a sacking offense? Obviously not the numerous piss poor performances we have to endure most weeks, or the knack of snatching a loss (or draw) from the jaws of victory in the 90th+ minute or consistently getting dumped out of the cup by lower league teams.

To be fair, he doesn’t have a squad of world beaters at his disposal but bloody hell, he is doing the same shit his predecessors did and they got shown the door.
 
BurbankHibee said:
So what would be a sacking offense? Obviously not the numerous piss poor performances we have to endure most weeks, or the knack of snatching a loss (or draw) from the jaws of victory in the 90th+ minute or consistently getting dumped out of the cup by lower league teams.

To be fair, he doesn’t have a squad of world beaters at his disposal but bloody hell, he is doing the same shit his predecessors did and they got shown the door.
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How many times have lower League teams dumped us out cups under SDG?
 
Keithd1875 said:
How many times have lower League teams dumped us out cups under SDG?
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Keith, all 4 exits from cup competitions in his tenure have been incredible disappointing.

We lost to Celtic at Parkhead which is no shame but only reason we had that is because we lost to part time kelty hearts. That was a shocker.

We then took over 7k of us to Celtic park in the Scottish against a Celtic team who were beginning to wobble and we had one shot on target.

A shocker of a display at Ibrox. Losing at Ibrox no shame but with fan protests and Russell Martin at the helm we barely laid a glove on them.

Yesterday’s embarrassing performance and shocker of a result. And what a surprise we lost to an injury time goal which gray can’t seem to sort. Mentality is weak in the latter stages of games.

Millions spent on a team that’s sitting 5th. Would another manager get better out of this squad of players ?

His time is up. I wish him well but it’s time to go at the end of the season.
 
Let’s be honest everyone watching yesterday’s game must have questioned the team selection, to tinker with a winning team and play players who did nothing was bad enough, but how he didn’t change it at half time was bad enough, personally I felt from the first five minutes we played with no passion or confidence, the Hibs fans I feel sensed it wasn’t going to be our day as we were very quiet apart from block 7, Lennon got Dunfermline to half time at 0 0 and you could see he had them fired up as there start to the 2nd half showed, over the piece they showed more commitment and passion than hibs, why was this, it’s okay getting yourself up for a derby but why not in a Scottish cup tie , questions also must be asked why we have not strengthened areas we are struggling in but at the end of the day everyone new when Dunfermline got the 2nd corner what was going to happen, to think the first corner was totally avoidable if rocky just heads it back to his keeper
 
cleanyman said:
Keith, all 4 exits from cup competitions in his tenure have been incredible disappointing.

We lost to Celtic at Parkhead which is no shame but only reason we had that is because we lost to part time kelty hearts. That was a shocker.

We then took over 7k of us to Celtic park in the Scottish against a Celtic team who were beginning to wobble and we had one shot on target.

A shocker of a display at Ibrox. Losing at Ibrox no shame but with fan protests and Russell Martin at the helm we barely laid a glove on them.

Yesterday’s embarrassing performance and shocker of a result. And what a surprise we lost to an injury time goal which gray can’t seem to sort. Mentality is weak in the latter stages of games.

Millions spent on a team that’s sitting 5th. Would another manager get better out of this squad of players ?

His time is up. I wish him well but it’s time to go at the end of the season.
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We're using away cup defeats in Glasgow as a stick to beat our manager. Fucking mental
 
BurbankHibee said:
So what would be a sacking offense? Obviously not the numerous piss poor performances we have to endure most weeks, or the knack of snatching a loss (or draw) from the jaws of victory in the 90th+ minute or consistently getting dumped out of the cup by lower league teams.

To be fair, he doesn’t have a squad of world beaters at his disposal but bloody hell, he is doing the same shit his predecessors did and they got shown the door.
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Hibs managers all get judged by the exactly the same credentials which is league position relative to budget, performances v the puddledrinkers, progress in cups and whether the football is a good watch or not. 🤔

On league position SDG exceeds any of the recent incumbents with a 3rd place in the bag and currently secure in 5th and battling for 4th. On any modern criteria this is excellent and relative to budget it is very decent as the Puddledrinkers, Celtc and "Scotland's Shame 2012" are financially well ahead of Hibs.

Heid to Heid against the Puddledrinkers SDG's record from 5 games is 3 wins , 1 defeat and a draw which is highly impressive by any Hibs manager in any historical period. ✌️

Progression in domestic cups has been very poor but is that due to performance such as yesterday's shocker or is it down to bad draws as playing away to Celtc in both last year's competitions and "Scotland's Shame 2012" this year is as hard as they come in any era and Hibs really weren't knocked out by Kelty. 🤔

The footballs not a great watch though as its pragmatic and predictable and there is a great reluctance to try to win games with a preference for holding on to results and playing the percentages in the closing stage. 😢

SDG doesn't alter much tactically and there is a strong case for saying that other managers have sussed this out big time and adjust there own teams and tactics accordingly😢.

SDG will get sacked as every Hibs manager runs out of time as injuries, transfers and players (and fans) getting tired of the same old voice will make his position untenable but at the moment judging SDG by the usual criteria then he more than deserves a shot at next season when he will have to build a new team minus Bowie and Mulligan. 🤔
 
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Keithd1875 said:
We're using away cup defeats in Glasgow as a stick to beat our manager. Fucking mental
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The 2 defeats in Glasgow were typical Gray performances sitting in and hoping for a break very boring football as for yesterday his team selection was wrong and should have been big enough to admit it by wholesale changes at halftime, but he chose to stick with the same then we again lose another last minute goal, this is down to the manager who has proven once again he has no plan b we have a squad which he is not getting the best out of , but he won’t be sacked but if we don’t make top 6 that may change
 
Malky McKays responsibility? I was never convinced with the praise heaped on him by some Hibs fans and the media

I dont really think SDG would have chosen a squad this unbalanced.

Greenmachine said:
We didn't lose that game today because David Gray played a "weakened team".
The players selected should have been able to beat Dunfermline Athletic...a mid table scottish championship team...in a one-off cup tie.
Unfortunately too many of them are just not up to dealing with a highly competitive cup-tie in Scotland.
Far too many of our players went into hiding today, not for the first time, and let the fans and the manager down big time.

IMO standards have fallen since last season.
I'm not convinced by the feeling of many that Hibs have a very good squad and that the manager is just not getting the best out of them.
When do players start to take responsibility ? They are the ones that have to go out there and do the job they are very well paid to do.
I think our squad has been left ridiculously light up top, and I think there are a few of our players who are overhyped as well.
We do have some good players, but not as many as a lot of fans seem to think.

I'm beginning to wonder about the quality of our recruitment now.
Too many overseas players from far flung places and English lower league scufflers who just cannot adjust to scottish football and it's demands.
Hibs have had this recruitment model for years now....and I now think we need to seriously think about changing it.

We have to now put all our efforts into trying to finish as high up the league as we can, and go for fourth place and possibly Europe again.
End of the season should not only see a serious review of the season passed, but just where we want to be as a club, and how we intend to get there.
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It's not even about formation for me but the intensity on the pitch. We have pretty decent midfielders who spend a good portion of a game watching the ball sail overhead.

As someone said earlier, it is tedious and boring.
 
Cavalier said:
It's not even about formation for me but the intensity on the pitch. We have pretty decent midfielders who spend a good portion of a game watching the ball sail overhead.

As someone said earlier, it is tedious and boring.
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Sail overhead OR sideways/backwards . I haven’t noticed Mulligan or McGrath( when played in the middle ) doing it 🤔
 
Purple & Green said:
Malky McKays responsibility? I was never convinced with the praise heaped on him by some Hibs fans and the media

I dont really think SDG would have chosen a squad this unbalanced.
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Reading between the lines you get a feel for players he's wanted and players perhaps he's not wanted. The selection or non selection tells a story.
 
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