Brexit

[Westside Green]

That was a play not History.

Maybe not and the whole Brexit fiasco is stranger than fiction.

The Ides of March comes from the ides, a term the Romans used to note the middle of a month. Every month has an ides around the middle (as well as a calends at the beginning of the month and nones eight days before the ides). The Ides of March feels special for a couple of reasons: it's the day Caesar was murdered, and it's the subject of a soothsayer's spooky prophecy in William Shakespeare's Julius Caesar.
The truth is actually more interesting.
For one, we know who the soothsayer was and what he really said: he was named Spurinna, and he was from Etruria. That's important, because Etruscans were known to specialize in divination. Cicero's letters , Plutarch, and Suetonius all confirm his high status. As notably, Spurinna's warning to Caesar was more complex — and more accurate — than the type of prophecy most modern skeptics would dismiss.
"They have a lot of contacts," Strauss says, "and they're people who know what's going on." That would have made Spurinna's prophecy a more frightening bellwether of the anti-Caesar sentiment in Rome. Soothsayers could poll the elites, and the elites did not like Caesar.
On February 15, Spurinna said he found a bad omen: a bull without a heart (it's unclear if the bull was a genetic abnormality, a shocking sign, or a soothsayer's poetic license). After that, Spurinna told Caesar to beware for the next 30 days, not just on the Ides of March. It wasn't a lucky prediction but rather a calculated assessment of Rome's political climate.
The end date of the prophecy wasn't a coincidence, either — on March 18, Caesar was going to embark on a multiyear military campaign that would take him away from Rome. The assassins had to kill him before he left.

 

[bigmanandy]

No vote on same deal unless substantial changes, we’ll done Bercow

 

[moathibby]

That'll set the cat amongst the pidgeons.Sometimes I quite like that silly old tory duffer.

 

[Doc Shrink]

That'll set the cat amongst the pidgeons.Sometimes I quite like that silly old tory duffer.

ORDURE!
ORDURE!

 

[Jack]

ORDURE!
ORDURE!

I'll ave a pint.

 

[Leith1975]

That'll set the cat amongst the pidgeons.Sometimes I quite like that silly old tory duffer.

He is quite entertaining at times, he seems have upset a few tories over the last few months which adds to his appeal.

 

[southfieldhibby]

Archived Petition: Revoke Article 50 and remain in the EU.

The government repeatedly claims exiting the EU is 'the will of the people'. We need to put a stop to this claim by proving the strength of public support now, for remaining in the EU. A People's Vote may not happen - so vote now.

petition.parliament.uk

I've not signed this

 

[Doc Shrink]

Archived Petition: Revoke Article 50 and remain in the EU.

The government repeatedly claims exiting the EU is 'the will of the people'. We need to put a stop to this claim by proving the strength of public support now, for remaining in the EU. A People's Vote may not happen - so vote now.

petition.parliament.uk

I've not signed this

Me neither.


502 Bad Gateway

 

[Jack]

502 Bad Gateway

It's a conspiracy I tell ye!

 

[southfieldhibby]

Me neither.


502 Bad Gateway

800,000 signatures in a day and the site is crashing alot.

Part of me is aiming for a chaos hard brexit for Scottish Independence, part of me isn't that mean.

 

[aggie]

Part of me is aiming for a chaos hard brexit for Scottish Independence, part of me isn't that mean.

I'd rather that than May's fcukin deal.

 

[Jack]

A bit of common sense in the Commons. Been a long long time in coming!

Angus B MacNeil MP
Been in touch with Speaker at #Commons
Next week i will, with other MPs, apply for a Debate under Standing Order 24 to push for Commons vote to #RevokeArticle50.
Revocation ends #Brexit in an afternoon & requires only one letter to EU .
Tweet/email your MP to support this.

 

[Leith1975]

A bit of common sense in the Commons. Been a long long time in coming!

Angus B MacNeil MP
Been in touch with Speaker at #Commons
Next week i will, with other MPs, apply for a Debate under Standing Order 24 to push for Commons vote to #RevokeArticle50.
Revocation ends #Brexit in an afternoon & requires only one letter to EU .
Tweet/email your MP to support this.

That will never happen imo. The deal will be voted down again next week and May will have to go to an emergency summit in Europe and beg for an extension. They will ask on what grounds are we asking for an extension. She won’t have a reasonable answer to that question at this point she will either have to resign or go for a longer extension that means we take part in the Euro elections. The other option is that she just lets the clock run down and we leave without a deal out of spite for not voting for her deal.

 

[Bofahibee]

Archived Petition: Revoke Article 50 and remain in the EU.

The government repeatedly claims exiting the EU is 'the will of the people'. We need to put a stop to this claim by proving the strength of public support now, for remaining in the EU. A People's Vote may not happen - so vote now.

petition.parliament.uk

I've not signed this

2 700 000 and still going up. Extraordinary

 

[Purple & Green]

I’m coming to the conclusion that this is a crisis, and probably the worst since the 70s.

 

[HenryLB]

Part of me is aiming for a chaos hard brexit for Scottish Independence, part of me isn't that mean.

I feel like that a bit as well - give them what they say they want and watch them twist in the wind trying to blame somebody else.

But there's a good chance no deal will be really bad and especially for the more vulnerable. Not saying the wheels will def come off, but of they do it'll be the weakest that suffer.

Also I'm wary of hoping for cataclysms to usher in the political outcomes we want. Elements of Labour are doing that, hoping that a chaotic brexit results in everyone wanting their brand of socialism. But historically that kind of disruption has often led to authoritarianism and even fascism.

 

[hibbybilly]

2 700 000 and still going up. Extraordinary

3,153000 odds now

 

[Bofahibee]

3,153000 odds now

It's been stuck there for ages - I know several people who have voted and not had the confirmation email.

 

[hibbybilly]

It's been stuck there for ages - I know several people who have voted and not had the confirmation email.

Couldnae get in yesterday but did 1st time on Southfields link.

 

[GORDONSMITH7]

2 700 000 and still going up. Extraordinary

What number passes the 17,410,742 mark give me another shout amigo.
As possibly the only publically abstentionist on here, in the run up to the vote, with good reasons neither to vote Yes or No, I think this broken record for a Peoples Vote by the Labour Blairite right, Liberals, SNP, the right wing so called Independent Group and Momentum, is tedious.
From a Labour Party perspective, as a member for decades, I find it incredible that Tony Blair and Alistair Campbell, the architects of the Peoples vote at the behest of Big Business have been given carte blanche to be on MSM to push this.
The irony for me is that Blair did not call for a Peoples vote when 2 million people in Britain demonstrated against his disastrous support for the War in Iraq, leaving hundreds of thousands of men, woman and kids dead, thousands left dead and injured in sectarian suicide attacks and the creation of ISIS. Good Socialists have been suspended from my Party. This gangster is still a member.

BIG G

 

[bigmanandy]

It's been stuck there for ages - I know several people who have voted and not had the confirmation email.

Mine took 24 hours to come through and ended up in the spam folder.

 

[Bofahibee]

What number passes the 17,410,742 mark give me another shout amigo.
As possibly the only publically abstentionist on here, in the run up to the vote, with good reasons neither to vote Yes or No, I think this broken record for a Peoples Vote by the Labour Blairite right, Liberals, SNP, the right wing so called Independent Group and Momentum, is tedious.
From a Labour Party perspective, as a member for decades, I find it incredible that Tony Blair and Alistair Campbell, the architects of the Peoples vote at the behest of Big Business have been given carte blanche to be on MSM to push this.
The irony for me is that Blair did not call for a Peoples vote when 2 million people in Britain demonstrated against his disastrous support for the War in Iraq, leaving hundreds of thousands of men, woman and kids dead, thousands left dead and injured in sectarian suicide attacks and the creation of ISIS. Good Socialists have been suspended from my Party. This gangster is still a member.

BIG G

Im a Green and I’m against Brexit because it comes from a very dubious right wing agenda that will do bugger all about climate change.

We live in a world where multi-national corporations have the power to sue governments while paying a pittance in tax. The only way to push back is for governments to work collectively and yes, for workers of the world to unite. .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Jack]

What number passes the 17,410,742 mark give me another shout amigo.
As possibly the only publically abstentionist on here, in the run up to the vote, with good reasons neither to vote Yes or No, I think this broken record for a Peoples Vote by the Labour Blairite right, Liberals, SNP, the right wing so called Independent Group and Momentum, is tedious.
From a Labour Party perspective, as a member for decades, I find it incredible that Tony Blair and Alistair Campbell, the architects of the Peoples vote at the behest of Big Business have been given carte blanche to be on MSM to push this.
The irony for me is that Blair did not call for a Peoples vote when 2 million people in Britain demonstrated against his disastrous support for the War in Iraq, leaving hundreds of thousands of men, woman and kids dead, thousands left dead and injured in sectarian suicide attacks and the creation of ISIS. Good Socialists have been suspended from my Party. This gangster is still a member.

BIG G

I'm surprised by your stance BIG G.
Forget the Labour squabbles of the past and present this Brexit is for the benefit of a few torys who are likely to make millions.
There isn't a Brexit scenario where the majority of UK nationals do well, indeed quite the reverse. The less well off you are the harder Brexit will hit.
Workers rights are already in the torys sights putting them back decades.
It will cost 100s of thousands of jobs, many have already been lost.
I can't see any benefits for Brexit for traditional Labour folk.

 

[GORDONSMITH7]

I'm surprised by your stance BIG G.
Forget the Labour squabbles of the past and present this Brexit is for the benefit of a few torys who are likely to make millions.
There isn't a Brexit scenario where the majority of UK nationals do well, indeed quite the reverse. The less well off you are the harder Brexit will hit.
Workers rights are already in the torys sights putting them back decades.
It will cost 100s of thousands of jobs, many have already been lost.
I can't see any benefits for Brexit for traditional Labour folk.

 

[WJC1848]

What number passes the 17,410,742 mark give me another shout amigo.
As possibly the only publically abstentionist on here, in the run up to the vote, with good reasons neither to vote Yes or No, I think this broken record for a Peoples Vote by the Labour Blairite right, Liberals, SNP, the right wing so called Independent Group and Momentum, is tedious.
From a Labour Party perspective, as a member for decades, I find it incredible that Tony Blair and Alistair Campbell, the architects of the Peoples vote at the behest of Big Business have been given carte blanche to be on MSM to push this.
The irony for me is that Blair did not call for a Peoples vote when 2 million people in Britain demonstrated against his disastrous support for the War in Iraq, leaving hundreds of thousands of men, woman and kids dead, thousands left dead and injured in sectarian suicide attacks and the creation of ISIS. Good Socialists have been suspended from my Party. This gangster is still a member.

BIG G

I have been Labour all my life, ten years as CLP secretary and will still be Labour after this Brexit fiasco. But I don't want a re-run for a different reason. I voted to remain but I was on the losing side. I have listened to all the arguments, telling me I didn't know this and I wasn't intelligent enough to understand that. I voted like everyone else on the issue: leave or remain. If a second vote is granted, I will expect, therefore, another vote immediately on all of the broken promises, my own party included, that have brought this country to the ridiculous state it is in at present: unacceptable levels of child poverty, food banks, homes not fit to live in - if you can get a home, that is ... and the list goes on. I need no telling that Scotland voted to remain. I need no telling that lies were told. I need no telling that things will be difficult. I need to be told that an all-party solution will rectify the sorry mess the Tories have manufactured through mismanagement and incompetence.

 

[GORDONSMITH7]

I have been Labour all my life, ten years as CLP secretary and will still be Labour after this Brexit fiasco. But I don't want a re-run for a different reason. I voted to remain but I was on the losing side. I have listened to all the arguments, telling me I didn't know this and I wasn't intelligent enough to understand that. I voted like everyone else on the issue: leave or remain. If a second vote is granted, I will expect, therefore, another vote immediately on all of the broken promises, my own party included, that have brought this country to the ridiculous state it is in at present: unacceptable levels of child poverty, food banks, homes not fit to live in - if you can get a home, that is ... and the list goes on. I need no telling that Scotland voted to remain. I need no telling that lies were told. I need no telling that things will be difficult. I need to be told that an all-party solution will rectify the sorry mess the Tories have manufactured through mismanagement and incompetence.

Absolutely spot on comrade. Thank goodness folk like you get it through the jungle of utter blithering guff.

BIG G

 

[Jack]

I'm not seeing any reply here BIG G.

 

[GORDONSMITH7]

I'm not seeing any reply here BIG G.

It was not worth it mate. Your everyone in Britain will be worse off particularly the poor and that a no deal would be a disaster to mankind, echoed by multinational manufacturing companies who would leave for cheaper non union counties whether in the EU or not is disingenuous. When did EU law prevent the Tories from introducing anti TU laws?
I totally understand why Big Business and the EU want Britain to remain from both their points of view.

BIG G

 

[bigmanandy]

I see Mr Blackford was greeted like shit by some gammon today.

 

[Jack]

It was not worth it mate. Your everyone in Britain will be worse off particularly the poor and that a no deal would be a disaster to mankind, echoed by multinational manufacturing companies who would leave for cheaper non union counties whether in the EU or not is disingenuous. When did EU law prevent the Tories from introducing anti TU laws?
I totally understand why Big Business and the EU want Britain to remain from both their points of view.

BIG G

With the prospect of many thousands becoming unemployed, queues for foodbanks growing at best estimates for generations to come as a result of Brexit it's good to know Labour are ignoring the present catastrophe for beer and crisps down the allotment.

 

[GORDONSMITH7]

With the prospect of many thousands becoming unemployed, queues for foodbanks growing at best estimates for generations to come as a result of Brexit it's good to know Labour are ignoring the present catastrophe for beer and crisps down the allotment.

Oh really O' Riley. I would suggest the present crisis, either within or outwith the EU is a crisis of Capitalism. It wont go away either way. Endemic and ultimately catastrophic internationally.

BIG G

 

[GORDONSMITH7]

Oh really O' Riley. I would suggest the present crisis, either within or outwith the EU is a crisis of Capitalism. It wont go away either way. Endemic and ultimately catastrophic internationally.

BIG G

I remember again from a Labour perspective warning against the right wing Machiavellian Labour deputy leader Tom Watson and being told by Nationalists on here he was a good guy in their eyes. Wrong, wrong, wrong.

BIG G

 

[Nex]

I just realised I've spent the last hour typing a deleting stuff trying to work out the right way to word some points and questions. I'm just going to batter some stuff down, please don't take anything as attacking if it reads that way, it's just my lack of sleep and frustration at not being able to get my thoughts out clearly.

WJC's hopes of an All-Party alliance to solve things is great and something I wish would happen but if there was any hope of that it would have occurred years ago never mind now with only 6 days left till we are due to leave with no kind of agreement reached, even if an extension is granted there isn't time to do much. Rebel Tories are few and far between, Labour are paralysed, Libs slit their own throat going into coalition with the Tories, the SNP have been putting ideas out there but none of the "UK wide" parties care.

Gordon you are quite right there are massive problems facing Scotland, and the UK, which started long before Brexit was a thing, and if we stay or leave the EU will for the most part not have any effect on those problems. In saying that though, there are more problems which could potentially be piled in on top of those as a result of the way Brexit is going.

Slightly off topic Gordon but do you mind me asking why you still vote Labour? I was only 8 when Blair became leader so for my entire adult life I have only known New Labour, the Labour of old was who my father voted for for decades until they stopped being that party. So to me there is only "the Labour Blairite right" as you put it (in so far as actual actions taken by the party) and Corbyn hasn't changed that. He has made little if any attempt to do anything for fear of turning the Blairites against him.

 

[PILTONSTANY]

The obvious solution here is to start a petition to overturn the Indy Ref result,surely all the pro Europeans will be in favour if given a chance to remain in the EU

 

[hibbybilly]

The obvious solution here is to start a petition to overturn the Indy Ref result,surely all the pro Europeans will be in favour if given a chance to remain in the EU

4,181,961 signatures now

 

[hibbybilly]

Did nae mean tae post that in PS’s post
4,181,961 signatures now.

 

[moathibby]

That petition is completely dodgy.All you have to do is set up as many email adresses as you want and you can sign the petition as many times as you like.

 

[moathibby]

The EU were never going to let the UK leave on good terms or easily. The EU need to send a message to any other members getting ideas of doing likewise. This deal is a disaster. We are kind of still in but with no say inside. Kind of out but not being able to enjoy the benefits that being out ought to bring. It's been poorly negotiated. We need to either be properly out or properly in.

And you wonder why I want out of the Eu?

 

[moathibby]

Im a Green and I’m against Brexit because it comes from a very dubious right wing agenda that will do bugger all about climate change.

We live in a world where multi-national corporations have the power to sue governments while paying a pittance in tax. The only way to push back is for governments to work collectively and yes, for workers of the world to unite. .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So we buy Nuclear Power Stations from France?

 

[moathibby]

My Birthday's on April 12th!Quite looking forward to it!