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At least 120 schools adopt gender-neutral uniforms, charity says

BurbankHibee

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The fashion for the future will be the one piece boiler suite favored by 1960's SyFy visitors to earth.

At least 120 schools now have a gender-neutral school uniform policy, and primary schools are adopting the stance faster than secondary schools, a charity that develops LGBT training in schools has said.

The independent Highgate school hit the headlines at the weekend for consulting parents on whether to introduce gender-neutral uniforms, allowing boys and girls to choose between skirts and trousers, along with other measures such as unisex toilets and addressing all students as “pupils” rather than boys or girls.

But hundreds of other schools have been quietly implementing similar policies with little fuss.

“Lots of schools are doing it very quietly, very unobtrusively: they’re just getting on with it,” said Susie Green, chief executive of Mermaids, a charity that works with children with gender identity issues and their parents.

Many of the schools are drawing on money from a £4.4m government fund to tackle homophobic, transphobic and biphobic bullying.
The Guardian
 

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egb_hibs

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A few years ago when clause 28 repeal was the topic of the day, it was argued that it was impossible to 'promote' sexuality type stuff in any case. A few years later on, and whatever the rights or wrongs of repeal, we see that claim for the lie it always was - one of the countless examples of the casual mendacity that accompanies 'progessive' salami slicing. And whether they were on target or off with their aim, we see the kind of barmies that permeate the education system that the Tories were originally trying to constrain - thought since the BBC brought them to heel the Tories seem closer to fellow travelers these days.

Shocking that when they are at a vulnerable age kids are getting their heads filled with this transgender nonsense. I wonder how many kids, who in another era would simply have been emos or smiths fans, will end up surgically multilated before this fad gives way to some new mania.
 

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A few years ago when clause 28 repeal was the topic of the day, it was argued that it was impossible to 'promote' sexuality type stuff in any case. A few years later on, and whatever the rights or wrongs of repeal, we see that claim for the lie it always was - one of the countless examples of the casual mendacity that accompanies 'progessive' salami slicing. And whether they were on target or off with their aim, we see the kind of barmies that permeate the education system that the Tories were originally trying to constrain - thought since the BBC brought them to heel the Tories seem closer to fellow travelers these days.Shocking that when they are at a vulnerable age kids are getting their heads filled with nonsense. I wonder how many kids, who in another era would simply have been emos or smiths fans, will end up surgically multilated before this fad gives way to some new mania.
Gotta agree with you eegie. Sad days.
 

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"In another million years, there'll be no men, no women. There'll just be people. Just a whole world full of wankers."
 

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Gotta agree with you eegie. Sad days.
I hear tales from my kids of peers who suggest that their gender identity is x, y or z. I have had to explain that x, y and z are satires ; internet pish takes of the whole phenomenon. But these kids are apparently convinced that's what they are.

That's where we are now; kids getting into this bandwagon and being so confused they can't tell between the made up stuff of identity politics and the made up stuff of folk ripping the pish out of it - and denied proper adult guidance due to the increasingly theocratic order we live under.

That said, I think we're close to a tipping point - I think the loonies are going to jump the shark and lose their grip.
 

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I hear tales from my kids of peers who suggest that their gender identity is x, y or z. I have had to explain that x, y and z are satires ; internet pish takes of the whole phenomenon. But these kids are apparently convinced that's what they are.That's where we are now; kids getting into this bandwagon and being so confused they can't tell between the made up stuff of identity politics and the made up stuff of folk ripping the pish out of it - and denied proper adult guidance due to the increasingly theocratic order we live under. That said, I think we're close to a tipping point - I think the loonies are going to jump the shark and lose their grip.
Best one i saw was on Aviva investors website on an online application form. Under 'title' the dropdown menu had 'MX' on it. Wtf is that, i wondered. One google later and i found this:
A title used before a person's surname or full name by those who wish to avoid specifying their gender or by those who prefer not to identify themselves as male or female.
Next question on the application form was gender. Two options - male or female. :rollfloor
 

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I hear tales from my kids of peers who suggest that their gender identity is x, y or z. I have had to explain that x, y and z are satires ; internet pish takes of the whole phenomenon. But these kids are apparently convinced that's what they are.

That's where we are now; kids getting into this bandwagon and being so confused they can't tell between the made up stuff of identity politics and the made up stuff of folk ripping the pish out of it - and denied proper adult guidance due to the increasingly theocratic order we live under.
It is pretty bad here and seems to affect the girls more than the boys. I hear about a lot of sexually confused girls. I wonder if it is worse in the UK.
 

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"In another million years, there'll be no men, no women. There'll just be people. Just a whole world full of wankers."
Indeed Mr Renton. I read a report recently that said the evidence is that the youth of today increasingly wait until their 20s and have a lot less sex than the youth of 30 years ago. Given my own misadventures of a horny teenager that could only mean wanking, and lots of it.
 

vasco de gama

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A few years ago when clause 28 repeal was the topic of the day, it was argued that it was impossible to 'promote' sexuality type stuff in any case. A few years later on, and whatever the rights or wrongs of repeal, we see that claim for the lie it always was - one of the countless examples of the casual mendacity that accompanies 'progessive' salami slicing. And whether they were on target or off with their aim, we see the kind of barmies that permeate the education system that the Tories were originally trying to constrain - thought since the BBC brought them to heel the Tories seem closer to fellow travelers these days.

Shocking that when they are at a vulnerable age kids are getting their heads filled with this transgender nonsense. I wonder how many kids, who in another era would simply have been emos or smiths fans, will end up surgically multilated before this fad gives way to some new mania.
Warning EGB this is one of my woolly posts where I'm trying to vocalize unfinished and partially uninformed thoughts so don't just shout it down as nonsense thanks.

Do you really think this is just a fad rather than just being part of the trend that the more unusual' beliefs, lifestyles and fashions generate more attention. By this I mean that the bigger the outcry over trans / fluid or whatever the current thing is then the more kids and the disaffected would be drawn to it? If these topics were covered in the same boring way most topics were discussed in schools (and indeed society at large) is it feasible that instead of attracting the confused and vulnerable the reality would be closer to the truth i.e. Some people really are trans / bi / asexual etc and therefore shouldn't be constrained to 'the normal way' provided they aren't causing harm just as 'the normal' people can dress the way they choose with the same caveat. So in fact is it the reaction of conservatives rather than the looney left that increases the likelihood of the surgical mutalation in confused or lonely teenagers?
 

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Warning EGB this is one of my woolly posts where I'm trying to vocalize unfinished and partially uninformed thoughts so don't just shout it down as nonsense thanks.

Do you really think this is just a fad rather than just being part of the trend that the more unusual' beliefs, lifestyles and fashions generate more attention. By this I mean that the bigger the outcry over trans / fluid or whatever the current thing is then the more kids and the disaffected would be drawn to it? If these topics were covered in the same boring way most topics were discussed in schools (and indeed society at large) is it feasible that instead of attracting the confused and vulnerable the reality would be closer to the truth i.e. Some people really are trans / bi / asexual etc and therefore shouldn't be constrained to 'the normal way' provided they aren't causing harm just as 'the normal' people can dress the way they choose with the same caveat. So in fact is it the reaction of conservatives rather than the looney left that increases the likelihood of the surgical mutalation in confused or lonely teenagers?
I think political correctness avoids this being presented as you suggest (and I believe to be true) - that a small number of people are genuinely transgender, some physically intersex and other in 'brain wiring'. There is a huge jump from that to the nonsense that gender is 'fluid'
And with an endless number of invented categories. PC inhibits rational interventions to distinguish between things grounded in reality and magicala thinking where what people wish to be the case is presented as the case.

I don't know what a conservative viewpoint would be - suspect you are referring to a more US context; the U.K. doesn't really 'do' alternative viewpoints (good or bad) these days.
 

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Wife has the TV on in the morning, ITV. Piers Morgan never fails to send me off to work cursing.

Last couple of days there's been guests on discussing this with him and he's been Mr Traditionalist, kinda echoing my own views, which is annoying. The question he's posed each day to different guests is where does it stop? If a guy can decide to be a woman, and vice versa, or neither, is there anything to stop a white man deciding they're a black woman? Kinda dumb argument, and I'm sure someone will be along to explain it to me, but I could kinda see where his extreme logic was coming from.

When he asked what's to stop him from deciding to be an elephant and demanding elephant rights, I decided to go to work early.
 

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Indeed Mr Renton. I read a report recently that said the evidence is that the youth of today increasingly wait until their 20s and have a lot less sex than the youth of 30 years ago. Given my own misadventures of a horny teenager that could only mean wanking, and lots of it.
The quote is actually from Gregory's Girl (showing my age!). The screenwriter of Trainspotting must have nicked it for the film as I don't remember it in the novel.
 

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Wife has the TV on in the morning, ITV. Piers Morgan never fails to send me off to work cursing.

Last couple of days there's been guests on discussing this with him and he's been Mr Traditionalist, kinda echoing my own views, which is annoying. The question he's posed each day to different guests is where does it stop? If a guy can decide to be a woman, and vice versa, or neither, is there anything to stop a white man deciding they're a black woman? Kinda dumb argument, and I'm sure someone will be along to explain it to me, but I could kinda see where his extreme logic was coming from.

When he asked what's to stop him from deciding to be an elephant and demanding elephant rights, I decided to go to work early.
That women who pretended to be black has now got a book out arguing her case. The problem with this stuff is it folds in on itself and explodes; so she is able to draw on existing identity politics premises (i.e. that race is a social construct) as others do with gender here (i.e. gender is a social construct) and so it is a question of which construct one 'identifies' with.

I think she's got her peers bang to rights from an (il)logic point of view but it doesn't stop the 'burn the witch' stuff from the loudest advocates of gender fluidity.

At the risk of wandering off into typically obscure egb waters - what is interesting underneath all this is returning to ideas of thousands of years ago, when Christianity had the debate and concluded the soul / person is indivisible from their body versus a ghost inhabiting a meat machine. The former is of course much more in line with a scientfic materialist viewpoint
where, ironically, sections of secular philosophy are increasingly gripped by the notion that the person and the properties of the person are disembodied from their biology.
 
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Rather than blow our tops at political heath and safety gawn mad and worrying about the potential for this to be mangled into a really sinister tool to destroy our children's fragile little minds how about the fact that this probably fixes a whole lot of problematic situations for kids who's otherwise have an absolute nightmare at school.

Or, I suppose you could protect the bullies rights to be ****s.

Sweet idea; Bullies Rights! IT'S PC GAWN MAD!
 

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Rather than blow our tops at political heath and safety gawn mad and worrying about the potential for this to be mangled into a really sinister tool to destroy our children's fragile little minds how about the fact that this probably fixes a whole lot of problematic situations for kids who's otherwise have an absolute nightmare at school.

Or, I suppose you could protect the bullies rights to be ****s.

Sweet idea; Bullies Rights! IT'S PC GAWN MAD!
I put it to you that it risks messing up a lot more kids than it helps while we fail to distinguish - as above - between reality (a vanishingly small number of people are either physically intersex or profoundly believe their organs are out of line with the sex they perceive themselves to be) and fantasy (gender is a fluid concept to be endlessly redefined by identity politics mavens or Facebook pisstakers, as they see fit). Are you for example aware of the, frankly, dangerous lunacy that tries to frame Tom boys as transgender ?

On your general point - I take it that it you are happy to see boys and girls share toilets for the benefit of a minuscule population who won't be represented at all in most schools, you are equally happy to see them separated again and indeed classrooms separated also, to suit the much larger minority of conservative muslims? Or on school uniforms, should we accommodate veils or whole body and face shrouds ?

Or do we turn everything upside down for some minorities but not others?

Which bullies do you have in mind btw; it's pretty clear where the systematic bullying comes from - the pc engineers of human souls
as Lenin might have put it (or was it Stalin ?)
 

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I put it to you that it risks messing up a lot more kids than it helps while we fail to distinguish - as above - between reality (a vanishingly small number of people are either physically intersex or profoundly believe their organs are out of line with the sex they perceive themselves to be) and fantasy (gender is a fluid concept to be endlessly redefined by identity politics mavens or Facebook pisstakers, as they see fit).

On your general point - I take it that it you are happy to see boys and girls share toilets for the benefit of a minuscule population who won't be represented at all in most schools, you are equally happy to see them separated again and indeed classrooms separated also, to suit the much larger minority of conservation muslims. Or on school uniforms, should we accommodate veils or whole body and face shrouds ?

Or do we turn everything upside down for some minorities but not others?

Which bullies do you have in mind btw; it's pretty clear where the systematic bullying comes from - the pc engineers of human souls
as Lenin might have put it (or was it Stalin ?)
We're talking about the same thing here, eh? Unisex, nondescript school uniforms? This has got you all 'I'm not a Tory, But...'?

I put it back to you that something so easy for us to do, with little effort on anyone's part helps far more children than you can perceive as it levels the playing field. Kids still have the choice in this scenario anyway, they're not forced into anything. Not that I think unisex clothing could even possibly be construed as damaging in any conceivable way.

What have sex organs, transitioning, sex, identity politics got to do with this?

Here's the situation; lets make things easier for kids.
Here's the response I'd expect; Yes, lets do that.
Here's the actual response; NO! I cannot understand why you'd want to change our children's sex against their parents will.

Why is this the leap you and loads of folk always make? I only see this situation, where they try to remove the potential for children feeling crapppy, awkward, weird, different and ostracised as a positive thing for society.

RE toilets; I don't see a need for toilets to be de-segregated. Girls are at a higher risk from attack by boys, why would you think I'd even think that was a good idea? I don't see a need to segregate schools that already exist as non segregated institutions. If you want to start a muslim school, fire away. Re the veils and shrouds in a uniform, I really don't see what the big deal is with a veil or the like. You go to a school and wear their uniform, cool, you want to put a veil on too? Why would we every care in the slightest about that unless it was dangerous (whist doing techy or whatever)?

Not turning anything upside down for any imaginary / real, massive or tiny minority. It's about being inclusive and giving a fuck about humans.

Like PC, it's sometimes cumbersome as fuck but, it began with truly good intentions. When you consistently focus on the bad in things, in it, you have to forgive me if I'm kinda taken aback that you must surely have preferred the good old days of proper british racism, those days when we could bloody well enjoy lovely Tracy from Essex on our beer cans or Page 3 or whatever?

I dunno where the leaps from good intentions to the destruction of the human race come from. And, considering at an actual biological / physiological level we are all moving in a double x chromosome direction, as a human race, we'll all be homogeneous at some point anyway (a fair bit away, I'll grant us), we'll be looking back and laughing at this crazy time of bothering to talk about it like we could even make any difference even if we tried.

'Mon the singularity.
 

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Missed your last point re bullies, couldn't see it in chrome for some reason, feckin windows.

Anyhoo...

Don't really know why you'd think I'd distinguish between any kind of bully. Bullying is bullying whether the person has a government mandate to do it or just hates the other person, or indeed, and more likely, themselves.

Trying to make children grow up in a less stressful environment and probably be more accepting or others doesn't really sound like bullying to me.

Of course, I know why you construe it like that. And, there are folk that shrilly harm my case but, you know I'm not fighting for them, that's not my voice. Not my cause.


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We're talking about the same thing here, eh? Unisex, nondescript school uniforms? This has got you all 'I'm not a Tory, But...'?

I put it back to you that something so easy for us to do, with little effort on anyone's part helps far more children than you can perceive as it levels the playing field. Kids still have the choice in this scenario anyway, they're not forced into anything. Not that I think unisex clothing could even possibly be construed as damaging in any conceivable way.

What have sex organs, transitioning, sex, identity politics got to do with this?

Here's the situation; lets make things easier for kids.
Here's the response I'd expect; Yes, lets do that.
Here's the actual response; NO! I cannot understand why you'd want to change our children's sex against their parents will.

Why is this the leap you and loads of folk always make? I only see this situation, where they try to remove the potential for children feeling crapppy, awkward, weird, different and ostracised as a positive thing for society.

RE toilets; I don't see a need for toilets to be de-segregated. Girls are at a higher risk from attack by boys, why would you think I'd even think that was a good idea? I don't see a need to segregate schools that already exist as non segregated institutions. If you want to start a muslim school, fire away. Re the veils and shrouds in a uniform, I really don't see what the big deal is with a veil or the like. You go to a school and wear their uniform, cool, you want to put a veil on too? Why would we every care in the slightest about that unless it was dangerous (whist doing techy or whatever)?

Not turning anything upside down for any imaginary / real, massive or tiny minority. It's about being inclusive and giving a $#@! about humans.

Like PC, it's sometimes cumbersome as $#@! but, it began with truly good intentions. When you consistently focus on the bad in things, in it, you have to forgive me if I'm kinda taken aback that you must surely have preferred the good old days of proper british racism, those days when we could bloody well enjoy lovely Tracy from Essex on our beer cans or Page 3 or whatever?

I dunno where the leaps from good intentions to the destruction of the human race come from. And, considering at an actual biological / physiological level we are all moving in a double x chromosome direction, as a human race, we'll all be homogeneous at some point anyway (a fair bit away, I'll grant us), we'll be looking back and laughing at this crazy time of bothering to talk about it like we could even make any difference even if we tried.

'Mon the singularity.
Tories, destruction of the human race? Double xx chromosomes ?

Wtf, wtf, wtf?

I am talking about the reality-bending stuff that kids are subject to (wait till your own are at secondary school age!) the uniforms question is just emblematic (and the toilets thing is happening) - and no I don't think it's harmless in its own right, because muddling young kids about the objective reality of sex and gender is not a great idea. It is you who is spiralling off into the blueyonder where I guess you'd accuse those sceptical of pc of doing just that.

As for good intentions - every ideological act large or small is generally grounded in good intentions- that doesn't mean the outcome is good; and the potty extremes of identity politics sure aren't. (I find it truly inexplicable that you have asked what transgenderism and identity politics have got to do with this - that's the topic!)

The final bit, while I expect tongue in cheek, is I think a seriously held view for some and gets to the perversity at the bottom of pc extremism - it absolutely cannot abide difference and diversity even as it rabbits on endlessly about them. I suspect the goal is as it has always been among its ideological ancestors - everyone exactly the same, now down to everyone being sexless coffee coloured clones, Mao suits made flesh - no one faster, stronger, smarter, no one different at all. Most of all and priority number one; no one thinking differently.
 

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Tories, destruction of the human race? Double xx chromosomes ?

Wtf, wtf, wtf?

I am talking about the reality-bending stuff that kids are subject to (wait till your own are at secondary school age!) the uniforms question is just emblematic (and the toilets thing is happening) - and no I don't think it's harmless in its own right, because muddling young kids about the objective reality of sex and gender is not a great idea. It is you who is spiralling off into the blueyonder where I guess you'd accuse those sceptical of pc of doing just that.

As for good intentions - every ideological act large or small is generally grounded in good intentions- that doesn't mean the outcome is good; and the potty extremes of identity politics sure aren't. (I find it truly inexplicable that you have asked what transgenderism and identity politics have got to do with this - that's the topic!)

The final bit, while I expect tongue in cheek, is I think a seriously held view for some and gets to the perversity at the bottom of pc extremism - it absolutely cannot abide difference and diversity even as it rabbits on endlessly about them. I suspect the goal is as it has always been among its ideological ancestors - everyone exactly the same, now down to everyone being sexless coffee coloured clones, Mao suits made flesh - no one faster, stronger, smarter, no one different at all. Most of all and priority number one; no one thinking differently.
The Tory bit was a reference to Section 28, not very clear, I'll admit! Destruction of the human race was a reference to every mention of how we're all going to hell n a hand cart because of PC gone mad. And, chromosome reference was to do with the generally held view in genetics of that being the direction we're going in. Probably not that clear either!

My oldest is in secondary, about to hit S3. Boys that are boys seem to be pretty able to be boys. Same for girls. Don't see it being that easy for the ones that feel that they're a bit of both or not the right one, but fuck em, eh? (Tongue in cheek there, man).

You get good and bad, we should be able to discern and reject the bad. That doesn't seem insurmountable to me.

I'm defending things being helpful to kids at an inclusive individual level. I'm not talking about fuckin participation medals. Fuck that.

Mind being horrified, when my son was wee, going to pals parties and finding that 'no one gets to lose' at pass the parcel. There was a present in every layer. What the hairy fuck?!

I don't want individuality destroyed for the sake of homogeneity. But I do want folk to be looked after and not told to man up or rejected or ridiculed or beaten because they don't fit the proscription.




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