Corona virus on its own thread.

[eckmf]

Places such as pubs, restaurants, cinemas and theatres won’t be opening until we have a vaccine, I think football stadiums could be counted in that.

 

[Nex]

My boss bought me a face mask, a reusable one. I'm not sure anyone in the frontline would thank me for it as I can't breathe when I'm wearing it and my glasses steam up so I can't see!

I'm not sure how easy it would be to bodge something removable onto your mask but the Japanese ones I've seen specifically for people with glasses have foam pads between the top of the mask and your face under your eyes.

If you don't happen to have any soft foam lying about maybe some little rolls of fabric would work, held on by a wee bit of folded stickytape if you wanted it to be totally removable without damaging the mask. Or you could put a couple of small loops of thread on whatever you are using as a barrier and hang it from the frame of your glasses either side of the lens.

 

[Greenmachine]

Places such as pubs, restaurants, cinemas and theatres won’t be opening until we have a vaccine, I think football stadiums could be counted in that.

Well, if you are right we had better hope a vaccine is found very much sooner than is currently being said, because if it is not going to be available for another year or so then, never mind about the current farcical vote taking place, in a years time we will have to reconstruct the remnants of what is left of the leagues anyway as there will be very few if any clubs still functioning in scottish football.
The same goes for pubs, restaurants, cinemas etc. None of them will survive beyond the summer with no money coming in.

 

[aggie]

Places such as pubs, restaurants, cinemas and theatres won’t be opening until we have a vaccine, I think football stadiums could be counted in that.

Nonsense, and an utterly ridiculous statement. There may never be a vaccine. One may arrive in 12 to 18 months, but there is no guarantee. Scientists have been looking for a vaccine for other Coronaviruses without success for decades.

What that leaves is that dreaded phrase, 'herd immunity'. The government cannot bring itself to suggest that some people - younger, healthier people - are at some point going to have to go out there and take a hit.

Can anyone suggest another long-term alternative?

 

[eckmf]

Nonsense, and an utterly ridiculous statement. There may never be a vaccine. One may arrive in 12 to 18 months, but there is no guarantee. Scientists have been looking for a vaccine for other Coronaviruses without success for decades.

What that leaves is that dreaded phrase, 'herd immunity'. The government cannot bring itself to suggest that some people - younger, healthier people - are at some point going to have to go out there and take a hit.

Can anyone suggest another long-term alternative?

We seem to be following the coat tails of Italy and all I saw fit to do was quote the health minister of Italy yesterday when the statement above was made. Do you honestly believe a season of football, playing to crowds of thousands will be commencing in August?

 

[aggie]

We seem to be following the coat tails of Italy and all I saw fit to do was quote the health minister of Italy yesterday when the statement above was made. Do you honestly believe a season of football, playing to crowds of thousands will be commencing in August?

Yes, because, well, it has to, sooner or later.

If no vaccine is found, what do folk think is going to happen? Never play football ever again? Never open pubs ever again? Cinemas? Cafes? Cultural events, festivals? Does that sound like a world anyone wants to live in?

I ask this of the Bounce in general in all seriousness, because it seems to me folk are in collective denial – we cannot protect ourselves indefinitely from a flu. The dreaded "herd immunity" is NOT a strategy – it's an inevitability, inasmuch as sooner or later folk are going to have to go back to living again, which will entail many people catching it. Unless we all stay locked down indefinitely, which is insane.

 

[aggie]

It would appear that BIg Business in the US, Spain and Italy are screwing up the pressure to start lifting restrictions.

The Spanish government has said that many ‘non-essential’ businesses, including manufacturing and construction, can resume work today. For the past two weeks only essential construction work has been permitted, on public works and infrastructure.

FIEC, the European contractors federation, reported that its Spanish association member, CNC, has lobbied the Spanish government to enact legislation that will mitigate the impact of the health and economic crisis.

I hope that these respective Governments are not making terrible mistakes.

People before Profits.

BIG G

Further to my previous post, this slogan I feel is a little disingenuous. John Harris recently wrote that:

"Not everyone who instinctively wants the lockdown to be eased as soon as possible is guilty of putting profit before life. It is surely not irresponsible to wonder whether the suspension of everyday existence is not already proving unsustainable, and whether there might come a point when the risks of the virus are outweighed by damage to people’s lives that may prove irreparable."

It's so refreshing for someone on the left to make this point. Honestly, the people I've been forced into agreement with over the past few weeks! I'm talking Laura Perrins, Frazer Nelson. The reason for that is that the left have apparently succumbed to the most bizarre synonymisation of 'the economy' with neoliberal capitalism.

But the economy simply means the supply of money and the production and exchange of goods and services in any given social organisation. Neoliberal capitalism is the organisation of the economy to unjustly benefit a certain class, for sure.

However, the opposition of people's lives with the economy makes no sense given that people's lives are embedded in the economy, and always will be. There is the question of what kind of economy their lives should be embedded in, but that is not resolved just by destroying the economy as it exists.

Indeed, doing so will lead to a literal loss of life. For however corrupt and in need of progressive reform the economic system may be, its suddenly collapse will lead to a vast increase in what have come to be known as 'deaths of despair'. The high street cafe, for example, is not just a source of tax revenue, it is someone's life, a community hub where people come to meet. If such businesses are wiped out on a massive scale, the damage to the social fabric, and health, of this country will be immense.

You do not renovate a house by burning it to the ground..

 

[broonieboy]

Yes, because, well, it has to, sooner or later.

If no vaccine is found, what do folk think is going to happen? Never play football ever again? Never open pubs ever again? Cinemas? Cafes? Cultural events, festivals? Does that sound like a world anyone wants to live in?

I ask this of the Bounce in general in all seriousness, because it seems to me folk are in collective denial – we cannot protect ourselves indefinitely from a flu. The dreaded "herd immunity" is NOT a strategy – it's an inevitability, inasmuch as sooner or later folk are going to have to go back to living again, which will entail many people catching it. Unless we all stay locked down indefinitely, which is insane.

You Sir....are correct


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[eckmf]

I have memories as a kid hearing nightly reports from Vietnam giving death totals, this happened over years, this is what we will hear for years if we don’t get a vaccine. This is more than a flu, I have had the flu and although I was very ill I did not die.

this lock down stuff is for one reason only, to save the nhs from being over run. Money will talk at the end of the day and lives will be sacrificed and the nightly totals will be acceptable.

 

[emerald green]

Places such as pubs, restaurants, cinemas and theatres won’t be opening until we have a vaccine, I think football stadiums could be counted in that.

sorry eck, but thats simply nonsense.

edit: sorry eck, should have read the full page..... others have already pointed out your flawed post!

 

[GORDONSMITH7]

Further to my previous post, this slogan I feel is a little disingenuous. John Harris recently wrote that:

"Not everyone who instinctively wants the lockdown to be eased as soon as possible is guilty of putting profit before life. It is surely not irresponsible to wonder whether the suspension of everyday existence is not already proving unsustainable, and whether there might come a point when the risks of the virus are outweighed by damage to people’s lives that may prove irreparable."

It's so refreshing for someone on the left to make this point. Honestly, the people I've been forced into agreement with over the past few weeks! I'm talking Laura Perrins, Frazer Nelson. The reason for that is that the left have apparently succumbed to the most bizarre synonymisation of 'the economy' with neoliberal capitalism.

But the economy simply means the supply of money and the production and exchange of goods and services in any given social organisation. Neoliberal capitalism is the organisation of the economy to unjustly benefit a certain class, for sure.

However, the opposition of people's lives with the economy makes no sense given that people's lives are embedded in the economy, and always will be. There is the question of what kind of economy their lives should be embedded in, but that is not resolved just by destroying the economy as it exists.

Indeed, doing so will lead to a literal loss of life. For however corrupt and in need of progressive reform the economic system may be, its suddenly collapse will lead to a vast increase in what have come to be known as 'deaths of despair'. The high street cafe, for example, is not just a source of tax revenue, it is someone's life, a community hub where people come to meet. If such businesses are wiped out on a massive scale, the damage to the social fabric, and health, of this country will be immense.

You do not renovate a house by burning it to the ground..

You quote by John Harris from an article which I read in the Guardian the other day and liked should be read in full to get some context.

For millions, lockdown is not novels and quality family time but food parcels and hardship | John Harris

We need to tell the stories of low-paid and casual workers who are suffering in this coronavirus crisis, says Guardian columnist John Harris

www.theguardian.com

Let's make one thing clear Small Businesses in unpresidented numbers over the past 12 years have seen more bankruptcies and closures in living memory. The Tories are tied by a thousand threads to Big Business and it is them who have exerted pressure to lift measures, introduced to avert the pandemic from becoming an epidemic, Internationally.

Many Capitalist economies were in a precarious straight before the Virus hit and are even more so now. The economic system of Capitalism will not collapse, however the same Capitalist class in all these countries, as they did after the World Banking crisis, howled like Banshees for workers and their families to pay for that crisis through so called Austerity, as they will again once some semblance of normality returns. Make no doubt they put Profit before People.

BIG G

 

[aggie]

You quote by John Harris from an article which I read in the Guardian the other day and liked should be read in full to get some context.

For millions, lockdown is not novels and quality family time but food parcels and hardship | John Harris

We need to tell the stories of low-paid and casual workers who are suffering in this coronavirus crisis, says Guardian columnist John Harris

www.theguardian.com

Lets make one thing clear Small Businesses in unpresidented numbers over the past 12 years have seen more bankruptcies and closures of in living memory. The Tories are tied by a thousand threads to Big Business and it is them who have exerted pressure to lift measures, introduced to avert the pandemic from becoming an epidemic, Internationally.

Many Capitalist economies were in a precarious straight before the Virus hit and are even more so now. The economic system of Capitalism will not collapse, however the same Capitalist class in all these countries, as they did after the World Banking crisis, howled like Banshees for workers and their families to pay for that crisis through so called Austerity, as they will again once some semblance of normality returns. Make no doubt they put Profit before People.

BIG G

I don’t doubt that large corporations put profit before people, that’s not the point I’m making.

Rather, I’m saying that asserting that a lockdown must be lifted before long for everyone’s good is not the equivalent of “putting profit before people” and siding with said corporate interests. That’s a false equivalence.


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[GORDONSMITH7]

Further to my previous post, this slogan I feel is a little disingenuous. John Harris recently wrote that:

"Not everyone who instinctively wants the lockdown to be eased as soon as possible is guilty of putting profit before life. It is surely not irresponsible to wonder whether the suspension of everyday existence is not already proving unsustainable, and whether there might come a point when the risks of the virus are outweighed by damage to people’s lives that may prove irreparable."

It's so refreshing for someone on the left to make this point. Honestly, the people I've been forced into agreement with over the past few weeks! I'm talking Laura Perrins, Frazer Nelson. The reason for that is that the left have apparently succumbed to the most bizarre synonymisation of 'the economy' with neoliberal capitalism.

But the economy simply means the supply of money and the production and exchange of goods and services in any given social organisation. Neoliberal capitalism is the organisation of the economy to unjustly benefit a certain class, for sure.

However, the opposition of people's lives with the economy makes no sense given that people's lives are embedded in the economy, and always will be. There is the question of what kind of economy their lives should be embedded in, but that is not resolved just by destroying the economy as it exists.

Indeed, doing so will lead to a literal loss of life. For however corrupt and in need of progressive reform the economic system may be, its suddenly collapse will lead to a vast increase in what have come to be known as 'deaths of despair'. The high street cafe, for example, is not just a source of tax revenue, it is someone's life, a community hub where people come to meet. If such businesses are wiped out on a massive scale, the damage to the social fabric, and health, of this country will be immense.

You do not renovate a house by burning it to the ground..

A quote by John Harris from an article which I read in the Guardian the other day and liked should be read in full to get some context.

For millions, lockdown is not novels and quality family time but food parcels and hardship | John Harris

We need to tell the stories of low-paid and casual workers who are suffering in this coronavirus crisis, says Guardian columnist John Harris

www.theguardian.com

Let's make one thing clear Small Businesses in unpresidented numbers over the past 12 years have seen more bankruptcies and closures of Small Businesses in living memory. The Tories are tied by a thousand threads to Big Business and it is them who have exerted pressure to lift measures, introduced to avert the pandemic from becoming an epidemic, Internationally.

Many Capitalist economies were in a precarious straight before the Virus hit and are even more so now. The economic system of Capitalism will not collapse, however the same Capitalist class in all these countries, as they did after the World Banking crisis, howled like Banshee for workers and their families to pay for that crisis through so called Austerity, as they will again once some semblance of normality returns. Make no doubt they put Profit before People.

BIG G

 

[Rocky]

Further to my previous post, this slogan I feel is a little disingenuous. John Harris recently wrote that:

"Not everyone who instinctively wants the lockdown to be eased as soon as possible is guilty of putting profit before life. It is surely not irresponsible to wonder whether the suspension of everyday existence is not already proving unsustainable, and whether there might come a point when the risks of the virus are outweighed by damage to people’s lives that may prove irreparable."

It's so refreshing for someone on the left to make this point. Honestly, the people I've been forced into agreement with over the past few weeks! I'm talking Laura Perrins, Frazer Nelson. The reason for that is that the left have apparently succumbed to the most bizarre synonymisation of 'the economy' with neoliberal capitalism.

But the economy simply means the supply of money and the production and exchange of goods and services in any given social organisation. Neoliberal capitalism is the organisation of the economy to unjustly benefit a certain class, for sure.

However, the opposition of people's lives with the economy makes no sense given that people's lives are embedded in the economy, and always will be. There is the question of what kind of economy their lives should be embedded in, but that is not resolved just by destroying the economy as it exists.

Indeed, doing so will lead to a literal loss of life. For however corrupt and in need of progressive reform the economic system may be, its suddenly collapse will lead to a vast increase in what have come to be known as 'deaths of despair'. The high street cafe, for example, is not just a source of tax revenue, it is someone's life, a community hub where people come to meet. If such businesses are wiped out on a massive scale, the damage to the social fabric, and health, of this country will be immense.

You do not renovate a house by burning it to the ground..

Yep, there's a lot of truth in that. After all, if the figures are correct that 120,000 people died due to austerity, and I've no reason to doubt them, then it's clear that a poor economy (or more precisely a lack of wealth for the most vulnerable) can kill people.

However, I don't think that means that we should just throw all caution to the wind and let the virus sweep through (I know that's not what you're saying). I'd expect the exit from this to involve some combination of wearing masks / test and trace / better treatment of the virus (all the focus seems to be on vaccinating against, but actually if there was a powerful anti-viral that could treat the disease then many fewer people would die or get seriously ill). I'd also like to see a fundamental rebalancing of the global economy - there's enough wealth and resources to go around, even after this pandemic wreaks its damage. The trouble is it's held in too few hands.

So I can actually envisage football being back by August, but the chances are that it will be compulsory for the crowd to wear masks, and for the players to have been tested. I do worry that pubs and restaurants will come a lot later though, it's hard to see how those are conducive to wearing masks...

 

[aggie]

Yep, there's a lot of truth in that. After all, if the figures are correct that 120,000 people died due to austerity, and I've no reason to doubt them, then it's clear that a poor economy (or more precisely a lack of wealth for the most vulnerable) can kill people.

However, I don't think that means that we should just throw all caution to the wind and let the virus sweep through (I know that's not what you're saying). I'd expect the exit from this to involve some combination of wearing masks / test and trace / better treatment of the virus (all the focus seems to be on vaccinating against, but actually if there was a powerful anti-viral that could treat the disease then many fewer people would die or get seriously ill). I'd also like to see a fundamental rebalancing of the global economy - there's enough wealth and resources to go around, even after this pandemic wreaks its damage. The trouble is it's held in too few hands.

So I can actually envisage football being back by August, but the chances are that it will be compulsory for the crowd to wear masks, and for the players to have been tested. I do worry that pubs and restaurants will come a lot later though, it's hard to see how those are conducive to wearing masks...

Impossible for the government to underwrite the wages/income of pubs and restaurants for that long. Simply impossible.

So either we open them before then, or there’s none left by the time we do.

I can’t see any other outcome, happy to hear one though?


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[Rocky]

Impossible for the government to underwrite the wages/income of pubs and restaurants for that long. Simply impossible.

So either we open them before then, or there’s none left by the time we do.

I can’t see any other outcome, happy to hear one though?


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I've honestly no idea. Clearly paying people to do nothing is a major expense, but what if we got more creative? What if we recognised that a lot of people in hospitality industries aren't going to have jobs for an extended period of time and created alternative roles? Accelerate a programme of wind turbine manufacture maybe? Use the available 'labour' to create something that will continue to generate wealth after this is all over. Accelerate the dualling of the A9, which would supposedly also give the economy a boost. Divert the money that would otherwise go into unemployment benefits to subsidise the rebirth of manufacturing in the country. One thing that I'm sure will change as a result of the huge increase in the number of people with the facilities to work from home is a complete crash in the commercial property market - how can we repurpose office buildings towards manufacturing? Or affordable housing?

These are just off-the-cuff thoughts obviously, and I'm not suggesting that everyone in the hospitality industry can just turn their hand to engineering and construction, or that we'll have the raw materials to do so. Equally you can't suddenly flip an office block in a business park into a factory or a block of flats, but situations like this are going to mean we have to get creative with solutions. The only alternative is a lengthy dole queue which isn't going to help to rebuild the economy.

 

[PILTONSTANY]

Scumbags!
Buy Irn Bru

Bank increases bet that Irn-Bru maker AG Barr will fail

A Swiss private bank has upped its multi-million pound bet on Irn-Bru maker AG Barr to fail during the coronavirus crisis, The Ferret can reveal.

theferret.scot

 

[Jack]

Scumbags!
Buy Irn Bru

Bank increases bet that Irn-Bru maker AG Barr will fail

A Swiss private bank has upped its multi-million pound bet on Irn-Bru maker AG Barr to fail during the coronavirus crisis, The Ferret can reveal.

theferret.scot

I think the biggest non surprise there is that while governments around the world have outlawed the shorting practice to protect their businesses the UK government is sitting with its thumbs up its arse.

 

[aggie]

I've honestly no idea. Clearly paying people to do nothing is a major expense, but what if we got more creative? What if we recognised that a lot of people in hospitality industries aren't going to have jobs for an extended period of time and created alternative roles? Accelerate a programme of wind turbine manufacture maybe? Use the available 'labour' to create something that will continue to generate wealth after this is all over. Accelerate the dualling of the A9, which would supposedly also give the economy a boost. Divert the money that would otherwise go into unemployment benefits to subsidise the rebirth of manufacturing in the country. One thing that I'm sure will change as a result of the huge increase in the number of people with the facilities to work from home is a complete crash in the commercial property market - how can we repurpose office buildings towards manufacturing? Or affordable housing?

These are just off-the-cuff thoughts obviously, and I'm not suggesting that everyone in the hospitality industry can just turn their hand to engineering and construction, or that we'll have the raw materials to do so. Equally you can't suddenly flip an office block in a business park into a factory or a block of flats, but situations like this are going to mean we have to get creative with solutions. The only alternative is a lengthy dole queue which isn't going to help to rebuild the economy.

Well, you address rebuttal a) to an extent, i.e. a) can you see hundreds of ten-stone waitresses building motorways? And while we’re on the subject of motorways, while we are intending to avoid all further risk in life, why not ban motorways? After all, you’re more likely to die in a car than from Covid-19 .

But rebuttal b) is really what I’m getting at: is a world without pubs, restaurants, cinemas, gigs, football games, or any instance where we can gather and interact closely with one another really worth living in? The risk of disease and death lives with all of us, all the time. It’s a necessary condition of being alive. I just don’t see that indefinitely removing all the things that make living a joy, leaving only socially-distanced work for the sake of work, in order that we can minimise risk to the nth degree, is worth it.

Am I really alone here in thinking everyone has gone a little insane? Folk are seriously entertaining the suspension of life itself until a vaccine that may never be found comes along, for the sake of a threat that wouldn’t even make it into the top 10 killers of human beings? (Road death is #8)


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[Rocky]

Well, you address rebuttal a) to an extent, i.e. a) can you see hundreds of ten-stone waitresses building motorways? And while we’re on the subject of motorways, while we are intending to avoid all further risk in life, why not ban motorways? After all, you’re more likely to die in a car than from Covid-19 .

But rebuttal b) is really what I’m getting at: is a world without pubs, restaurants, cinemas, gigs, football games, or any instance where we can gather and interact closely with one another really worth living in? The risk of disease and death lives with all of us, all the time. It’s a necessary condition of being alive. I just don’t see that indefinitely removing all the things that make living a joy, leaving only socially-distanced work for the sake of work, in order that we can minimise risk to the nth degree, is worth it.

Am I really alone here in thinking everyone has gone a little insane? Folk are seriously entertaining the suspension of life itself until a vaccine that may never be found comes along, for the sake of a threat that wouldn’t even make it into the top 10 killers of human beings? (Road death is #8)


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I think it's a balance. Like I said before things like football matches can go ahead easily enough if people wear masks. Restaurants may be ok too because the nature of them is that you're only really facing your own party. One of my local restaurants halved the number of tables before lockdown to enable social distancing.. Maybe pubs can work too if they switch to table service for example, and limit the number of punters.

 

[Fernando]

I think the biggest non surprise there is that while governments around the world have outlawed the shorting practice to protect their businesses the UK government is sitting with its thumbs up its arse.

Must come from a long line o phanies ?

 

[Jack]

Re the vaccine that might never come on the basis there's never been one for previous flu pandemics.

The trouble with previous pandemics was that once the big hit had been passed and no vaccine had been found there was no real need for a vaccine to be found so funding and research dried up.

This is the first really huge pandemic we've had for ages and there's been huge advances in medical science in that time. So there's a better chance this time that science will win the race.

 

[Purple & Green]

Re the vaccine that might never come on the basis there's never been one for previous flu pandemics.

The trouble with previous pandemics was that once the big hit had been passed and no vaccine had been found there was no real need for a vaccine to be found so funding and research dried up.

This is the first really huge pandemic we've had for ages and there's been huge advances in medical science in that time. So there's a better chance this time that science will win the race.

I heard the woman from ineos who seemed to be saying she was certain there would be a vaccine in around a year. The major time lag element seemed to be the testing to make it safe.

 

[Jack]

I heard the woman from ineos who seemed to be saying she was certain there would be a vaccine in around a year. The major time lag element seemed to be the testing to make it safe.

Yeah, there's been lots of chat.

 

[bigmanandy]

Chancellor confirms when this is all over people will feel the pressure with a drop in incomes to pay back the debts.

 

[Forzahibs]

Chancellor confirms when this is all over people will feel the pressure with a drop in incomes to pay back the debts.

in what way ? Are you on about people on furlough ?

 

[emerald green]

Chancellor confirms when this is all over people will feel the pressure with a drop in incomes to pay back the debts.

Dont worry too much manders, we have been hardened to endure this as we have just had 10yrs of austerity!

 

[1875]

Chancellor confirms when this is all over people will feel the pressure with a drop in incomes to pay back the debts.

Many of those still working long shifts and have suffered a drop in wages already, I am doon 20% to cover the poor bastards that are furloughed. Note I am happy to if he helps my colleagues.

 

[Forzahibs]

Many of those still working long shifts and have suffered a drop in wages already, I am doon 20% to cover the poor bastards that are furloughed. Note I am happy to if he helps my colleagues.

What is he suggesting though ?

 

[Jack]

What is he suggesting though ?

Income Tax hike???

 

[Forzahibs]

Income Tax hike???

isn't tax devolved though ?

 

[Jack]

isn't tax devolved though ?

Not really no.

Westminster sets the main tax stuff, Scotland can fiddle it about a wee bit to raise extra funds.

 

[1875]

What is he suggesting though ?

No idea, its the tories.

 

[Rocky]

What is he suggesting though ?

I didn't see it but I'd imagine it was just a hint dropped initially with the intention of shifting the traditional Tory base towards pushing for an end to lockdown.

 

[GORDONSMITH7]

Not really no.

Westminster sets the main tax stuff, Scotland can fiddle it about a wee bit to raise extra funds.

Therefore yes. They can do as they wish. The UK Government give Scotland a cake , it is the sliced ever thinner slices to Cooncil etcs. In England, NI, and Wales it is the same. None of the Cooncils, throughout the UK no matter their complcetion , have said fuck this so called Austerity over the past 12 years. "We will cut sevices and prioritize what we cut to let others survive". Utterly hopeless cowards.. Ask the brilliant punters who have lead the fight to defend the existence of The Pilton Community Health Project, formed in Edinburgh in 1984, and Scotland's oldest. F*** off


BIG G

 

[1875]

I didn't see it but I'd imagine it was just a hint dropped initially with the intention of shifting the traditional Tory base towards pushing for an end to lockdown.

I heard tonight in a work environment the gossip in gov't is back to work after May 8th bank holiday.

 

[Smurf]

I heard tonight in a work environment the gossip in gov't is back to work after May 8th bank holiday.

It's going to be after one of the two May bank holidays apparently. There's divisions in Government on what one.

 

[Jack]

Therefore yes. They can do as they wish. The UK Government give Scotland a cake , it is the sliced ever thinner slices to Cooncil etcs. In England, NI, and Wales it is the same. None of the Cooncils, throughout the UK no matter their complcetion , have said fuck this so called Austerity over the past 12 years. "We will cut sevices and prioritize what we cut to let others survive". Utterly hopeless cowards.. Ask the brilliant punters who have lead the fight to defend the existence of The Pilton Community Health Project, formed in Edinburgh in 1984, and Scotland's oldest. F*** off


BIG G

Scotland gets half a cake!

 

[GORDONSMITH7]

Scotland gets half a cake!

Blame the bastard Tories, never mind suggest a fight back. The we canae do anything until Independence is lamentable. The Labour/SNP Edinburgh Council have been a shambolic disgrace in implementing the effects of Austerity.

BIG G

 

[GORDONSMITH7]

It's going to be after one of the two May bank holidays apparently. There's divisions in Government on what one.

P
Why do you think there are devisions K? It is much bigger than a date amigo.

BIG G