Leith Walk tram line extension blocked by the SNP

[GORDONSMITH7]

http://www.scotsman.com/news/transport/leith-walk-tram-line-extension-blocked-by-the-snp-1-3943716

I'll leave it to the Nats on here to support this move. Perhaps they can explain why Nat Councillors in the so called 'coalition' on the Cooncil voted for compulsory redundancies (2000 people). The Scottish Government Community Charge freeze will cost the Cooncil £140,000,000. Utterly bizarre policy up there with the Scottish Governments nutty proposal for me to pay less for my flight to Tenerife.

BIG G

 

[PILTONSTANY]

It was Labour that came up with the plans for Trams and the costs we're paying for the next 50 years...( SNP/Transport Scotland should've stepped in to run things when it became clear the council was out of it's depth)
I'm in favour of finishing the line but it's a shame because Leith Walk is looking the best in years.

Having not had a pay rise in 10 years i'm grateful for the CT freeze and i'm sure other low earners are too,Maybe with the drop in APD i'll be able to take my wee one on her 1st foreign holiday :glassraise:

 

[GORDONSMITH7]

It was Labour that came up with the plans for Trams and the costs we're paying for the next 50 years...( SNP/Transport Scotland should've stepped in to run things when it became clear the council was out of it's depth)
I'm in favour of finishing the line but it's a shame because Leith Walk is looking the best in years.

Having not had a pay rise in 10 years i'm grateful for the CT freeze and i'm sure other low earners are too,Maybe with the drop in APD i'll be able to take my wee one on her 1st foreign holiday :glassraise:

If you were one of the 2000 facing their jotters because of it, a foreign holiday will be the last thing on their minds. It also means £140 m cuts in what could be spent on social services.schools,nurseries, etc. Populist bollocks by the SNP government methinks.

BIG G

 

[PILTONSTANY]

If you were one of the 2000 facing their jotters because of it, a foreign holiday will be the last thing on their minds. It also means £140 m cuts in what could be spent on social services.schools,nurseries, etc. Populist bollocks by the SNP government methinks.

BIG G

Hopefully the muted tourist tax will help plug the huge debt built up by the council.

BTW if you have a look at the Pilton sucks website you'll see some cracking allegations of corruption in the council going back the last few years...

 

[emerald green]

eh, sorry big G, but you recently steamed into the Scottish Government in respect of the MUCH needed crossing and road upgrade round it. You stated that the money should have been put to social services (cant mind the exact place(s) you thought the money should go), and just a couple of weeks later yer at them again...for the opposite!... did ye see how much the trams cost ? no sure there were many SNP to blame for that disgrace!

So not sure what your angle is here.... you think that we should hoy another £140,000,000 in this climate to tram leith and her fabulous bus service

Im wi piltonstaney, I too am grateful for the CT freeze!

As a side, and not directed at yourself Big G, how come SNP bounce supporters have to justify EVERYTHING the SNP do or say ??? The reason for the SNP being where they are is solely down to Labour!! This country has voted labour for ever, and it doesnae seem to have done us that well! The reason I can say that with confidence is, well, the scottish people would have voted for them at the last GE. But they didnae. So there was an alternative to the tories now, and it's a group of like minded people who want to put the people of Scotland FIRST!

Easily the best government Scotland has had since the parish was built ootside lizzies big hoose!

 

[Shades]

Leaving the pros and cons of the topic aside for a moment, it baffles the living shit out of me why, on this and other forums I read, that Labour supporters scrutinise the SNP's governance on everything to the nth degree whilst ignoring and excusing the Tories in Westminster. We're constantly told to forget the Referendum and move on, yet it seems to me that some of the most vocal unionists invested so much in the better together campaign that the SNP have become bigger enemies to them than Cameron and Osbourne. Given that a helluva a lot of SNP supporters and indeed, members, were from labour roots, how can that have came about?

 

[emerald green]

Leaving the pros and cons of the topic aside for a moment, it baffles the living shit out of me why, on this and other forums I read, that Labour supporters scrutinise the SNP's governance on everything to the nth degree whilst ignoring and excusing the Tories in Westminster. We're constantly told to forget the Referendum and move on, yet it seems to me that some of the most vocal unionists invested so much in the better together campaign that the SNP have become bigger enemies to them than Cameron and Osbourne. Given that a helluva a lot of SNP supporters and indeed, members, were from labour roots, how can that have came about?

Outstanding post shades. I was going to type almost exactly that, but I need to roll a fat J. so ah didnae.

 

[Shades]

Outstanding post shades. I was going to type almost exactly that, but I need to roll a fat J. so ah didnae.

I'm envious - A relocation and lack of opperchancity has seen me devoid of any chronic for almost two years now. Never thought I'd see the day.....

 

[Dub]

Outstanding post shades. I was going to type almost exactly that, but I need to roll a fat J. so ah didnae.

That's prioritising at it's best there young man

 

[MixuDave]

Outstanding post shades. I was going to type almost exactly that, but I need to roll a fat J. so ah didnae.

Great minds and all big man, just sparked up
I too am grateful for the council tax freeze, seeing as I have had what is effectively a pay reduction for the last 6 yrs! But never mind that, that bloody bridge ffs..... #SNPBaaaaaaaaaaaad

 

[southfieldhibby]

I'm a Nat but no longer support the SNP.

I'd also be inclined to support an increase in council tax rates as well as stopping small business rate relief.. if it resulted in significant improvements in public services when both would see me contributing more.

In regards to the tram coming down the walk, the area on between leith walk and Easter road is the most densely populated part of Scotland, so I can see the logic in bringing it down, possibly even extending it towards portobello using the existing rail track there for the pipe works. I'd also make leith walk/ER a one way system and broaden the pavement on LW massively, take advantage of the obvious shore ditch isation of the walk.

We need an elected mayor like London

 

[GORDONSMITH7]

I'm a Nat but no longer support the SNP.

I'd also be inclined to support an increase in council tax rates as well as stopping small business rate relief.. if it resulted in significant improvements in public services when both would see me contributing more.

In regards to the tram coming down the walk, the area on between leith walk and Easter road is the most densely populated part of Scotland, so I can see the logic in bringing it down, possibly even extending it towards portobello using the existing rail track there for the pipe works. I'd also make leith walk/ER a one way system and broaden the pavement on LW massively, take advantage of the obvious shore ditch isation of the walk.

We need an elected mayor like London

Not sure about the elected Mayor but the rest is spot on M.

BIG G

 

[southfieldhibby]

Not sure about the elected Mayor but the rest is spot on M.

BIG G

Was just thinking more accountability

Also, taking the tram along to portobello would allow it to be integrated into the south side suburban circle line, which if I recall, was costed at about £200 million to electrify and reinstate stations.

Compare with the tram and it's enough to weep

 

[GORDONSMITH7]

Leaving the pros and cons of the topic aside for a moment, it baffles the living shit out of me why, on this and other forums I read, that Labour supporters scrutinise the SNP's governance on everything to the nth degree whilst ignoring and excusing the Tories in Westminster. We're constantly told to forget the Referendum and move on, yet it seems to me that some of the most vocal unionists invested so much in the better together campaign that the SNP have become bigger enemies to them than Cameron and Osbourne. Given that a helluva a lot of SNP supporters and indeed, members, were from labour roots, how can that have came about?

Check out the bloated Labour leadership, Corbyn and Dugdale threads. Fuck all about the rapacious anti working class cuts taking place by the Tories.None so blind as those who cannot see amigo. You should make an effort to understand that you can oppose Independence without being a Unionist. I do and am not. When the SNP government fucks up, privatisation of water services, Cal Mac shortly, or giving a Dutch state owned railway company a 10 year free run, it should be you guys that kick up fuck.

BIG G

 

[emerald green]

I'm a Nat but no longer support the SNP.

I'd also be inclined to support an increase in council tax rates as well as stopping small business rate relief.. if it resulted in significant improvements in public services when both would see me contributing more.

In regards to the tram coming down the walk, the area on between leith walk and Easter road is the most densely populated part of Scotland, so I can see the logic in bringing it down, possibly even extending it towards portobello using the existing rail track there for the pipe works. I'd also make leith walk/ER a one way system and broaden the pavement on LW massively, take advantage of the obvious shore ditch isation of the walk.

We need an elected mayor like London

Good post.
Im actually pretty much the same, I'm a Indie but no longer really support them. I joined them a couple of years ago, then left them post GE. (they now get access to huge election funds and can go toe to toe with lab/tories in future elections)... sort of now dinnae like scotland polictically danniiR

Broadly agree re the rates aswell, but cannae see, how in this digital age, we cannae bring in any CT rises through means testings? That could possibly be a nonsence comment and completely unworkable :rollfloor ....

Was fair gutted as I watched the tram horror show unfold, and realised the tram wasnae going down the walk to newhaven. Leith walk is a jewel of edinburgh which never gets the attention it deserves...it should be stunning!

 

[southfieldhibby]

I think the council is slowly beginning to realise the potential value in Leith Walk. I sincerely hope it doesn't become like Las Ramblas, and the beginning of social cleansing mentioned in this article needs to be guarded against as the area keeps its 'soul'

Brian Ferguson: Could former eyesore Leith Walk become the new Las Ramblas? - The Scotsman

- - - Updated - - -

Also, what's this about privatising CalMac?

 

[GORDONSMITH7]

I think the council is slowly beginning to realise the potential value in Leith Walk. I sincerely hope it doesn't become like Las Ramblas, and the beginning of social cleansing mentioned in this article needs to be guarded against as the area keeps its 'soul'

Brian Ferguson: Could former eyesore Leith Walk become the new Las Ramblas? - The Scotsman

- - - Updated - - -

Also, what's this about privatising CalMac?

CalMac Ferry workers strike against SNP privatisation

2 July, 2015 - 09:48


RMT members employed by Caledonian MacBrayne (CalMac) staged three days of industrial action, including a one-day strike, in the last week of June.

A ballot on industrial action held the preceding month had seen a massive majority vote for action: 92% for strike action, and 98% of action short of a strike, on a 60% turnout. The vote was so overwhelming that it passed the requirements of the Tories’ new anti-union legislation.

The dispute centres of the threat to jobs, pensions and working conditions resulting from the fact that the Clyde and Hebrides ferry services, currently provided by CalMac, have been put out to tender.

Tenders are to be submitted by December, with the result announced in May of next year.

Apart from CalMac, the international business-outsourcing company Serco is also bidding for the eight-year contract for the ferry services and the £1 billion a year funding that goes with it.

In 2012 Serco beat CalMac to win the contract for the Northern Isles ferry services – and then promptly attacked staffing levels and the pensions and terms and conditions of employment of the CalMac employees transferred into Serco.

Serco also recently took over the Caledonian Sleeper rail service from Scotland to London in another tendering process run by the SNP Scottish government (which also saw Scottish domestic rail services handed over to Abellio).

The RMT, to which around half of CalMac’s 1,400 workforce belongs, is demanding guarantees that, whoever wins the Clyde and Hebrides contract, there will be no compulsory redundancies, and pensions and terms and conditions of employment will be preserved.

The SNP government – which is overseeing the tendering process, as well as being the sole shareholder in David MacBrayne Ltd., of which CalMac is a subsidiary – has repeatedly refused to give such assurances.

Instead, its Transport Minister, David Mackay, has claimed that the tendering process – despite the risk of Serco winning the contract – does not amount to privatisation!

As RMT General Secretary Mick Cash responded: “It is extraordinary that rather than standing up for Scotland’s lifeline ferry services, those who hold political power have resorted to ludicrous arguments about what does and doesn’t represent privatisation.”

The SNP government has also claimed that EU rules oblige it to periodically put Scottish ferry services out to tender, although transport unions and the Scottish TUC have consistently argued that this is not the case.

With no movement from the SNP government in response to the RMT ballot result, RMT members staged a two-day work-to-rule followed by a 24-hour strike in the last week of June.

SNP Deputy First Minister praised Calmac’s response to the strike, saying that it had done a “commendable job” in allegedly ensuring there were sufficient services to carry 40% of normal passenger capacity during the strike.

The TSSA, which claims to represent around a hundred CalMac office staff, is currently also balloting its members.

The RMT’s industrial action also triggered a statement from the SNP Trade Union Group, which largely consisted of a series of homilies about good working conditions and the role of the SNP government in standing up for Scotland’s interests in Europe.

The response from the RMT was brief and to the point:

"This statement from a group claiming to represent trade unionists makes not a single mention of support for fellow trade unionists battling to defend jobs and services.

Instead, it hides behind a barrage of EU anti-worker legislation that has no relevance at all to this dispute and which could be challenged anyway with a united campaign.

You can't claim to be anti-austerity, pro-working-class and pro-public-services and then duck the issue when jobs and services are under all-out attack like on CalMac. The question to the SNP TU Group is: which side are you o‎n?"

- - - Updated - - -



By the way the RMT are not affiliated to the Labour Party and do not back it financially.

BIG G

 

[Smurf]

I'm a Nat but no longer support the SNP.

I'd also be inclined to support an increase in council tax rates as well as stopping small business rate relief.. if it resulted in significant improvements in public services when both would see me contributing more.

In regards to the tram coming down the walk, the area on between leith walk and Easter road is the most densely populated part of Scotland, so I can see the logic in bringing it down, possibly even extending it towards portobello using the existing rail track there for the pipe works. I'd also make leith walk/ER a one way system and broaden the pavement on LW massively, take advantage of the obvious shore ditch isation of the walk.

We need an elected mayor like London

Absolutely in favour of an elected mayor.

 

[FTJT]

Leaving the pros and cons of the topic aside for a moment, it baffles the living $#@! out of me why, on this and other forums I read, that Labour supporters scrutinise the SNP's governance on everything to the nth degree whilst ignoring and excusing the Tories in Westminster. We're constantly told to forget the Referendum and move on, yet it seems to me that some of the most vocal unionists invested so much in the better together campaign that the SNP have become bigger enemies to them than Cameron and Osbourne. Given that a helluva a lot of SNP supporters and indeed, members, were from labour roots, how can that have came about?

eegie argument there...

nobody disagrees here - that i'm aware - that the tories are butchers and ****s. However, there is a genuine tendency on here to shut down criticism of the SNP if it's inconvenient and accuse those responsible of being little englanders or closet tories or whatever - rather than just someone who thinks they should have built a tram...

 

[Doc Shrink]

That's prioritising at it's best there young man

You can call it that if you like.
Personally I think it's massively disrespectful to Jamie.

You guys need to get a grip.


Or a joint maybe. Just calm the fcuk down.

 

[Kenny]

http://www.scotsman.com/news/transport/leith-walk-tram-line-extension-blocked-by-the-snp-1-3943716

I'll leave it to the Nats on here to support this move. Perhaps they can explain why Nat Councillors in the so called 'coalition' on the Cooncil voted for compulsory redundancies (2000 people). The Scottish Government Community Charge freeze will cost the Cooncil £140,000,000. Utterly bizarre policy up there with the Scottish Governments nutty proposal for me to pay less for my flight to Tenerife.

BIG G

The tram isn't exactly seen as a success...ploughing money into while we've got folk using food banks doesn't sound great. The economic benefits seem limited. And the cost of the last grew a wee bit.

Sounds like an SNP bad rant... air flights are major for business, over 50% of all Glasgow airport flights go to the London area.

Your flight to tenerife would be a happy side effect of a plan to stimulate business ... but youre not daft and I suspect you know this .

Council tax might be a decent call but when the forced evictions come round cause folk can't afford it I'm guessing you'll not be happy about that either?

Calmac...not dodging it just don't know enough...

 

[The__Proclaimer]

Great minds and all big man, just sparked up
I too am grateful for the council tax freeze, seeing as I have had what is effectively a pay reduction for the last 6 yrs! But never mind that, that bloody bridge ffs..... #SNPBaaaaaaaaaaaad

Our schools are so decrepit they are literally killing our children but it's much easier to blame the English than make unpopular decisions.

 

[Kenny]

...also taking the worse case of each point as true... I have absolutely no confidence that any scottish party in Scotland would be better.

...strong opposition is a necessity and in the devolved parlament the UK parties LibLabCon seem hamstrung while they are at odds with there UK equivalents.

- - - Updated - - -

Our schools are so decrepit they are literally killing our children but it's much easier to blame the English than make unpopular decisions.

Not a critism of your point...is that Edinburgh only. .. Glasgow has rebuilt loads?

 

[southfieldhibby]

The CalMac thing had passed me by, who's telling the truth? The unions insist it doesn't have to be tendered, the govt insist it does? There must be a rule backing up one side or the other? I'd take a punt at the owner of the current franchisee being quite keen to keep it, considering they make quite the hooplah about that, Ferguson and Prestwick? But unions aren't going to ballot for strike action without genuine basis. That needs independent confirmation one or the other.


Schools, The SNP made a manifesto pledge in 08 (?) about reducing class room sizes for primary kids to 18. Stop laughing at the back. But equally, anyone living in Portobello can appreciate altering school catchments/building new schools is the ultimate nimby timebomb. Nearly impossible. Fair play at the current round of new builds though, the new Holyrood is excellent as I'm sure the new St Tams is and Porty will be too. Also a tranche of new primary schools built/being built. Specialist schools being shut too, so some not so good things.

APD. Jesting about cheap flights to Tenerife is fair game, but a reduction in costs to airlines/passengers to come to Scotland is significant. Edinburgh Airport might be a pain to go thru just now, but there is a reason for that-expansion.More planes, more jobs, more places connecting directly to/from Scotland.So it's not all about folk flying too places, but folk flying too Scotland.Tourism is essential for Scotland, we should be trying to encourage Felipe from Tenerife to come here on that very same seat Big G took the other way. Also the environmental aspect of reducing flights going via places like Heathrow should be considered.Better to get one plane to New York than two, no?

 

[Smurf]

#SNPGood #SNPNotToBeQuestioned

Just for good balance....

Here's my honest tuppence worth being serious... Being in government brings touch choices. And I've now concluded that until our Scottish Government has full control and responsibility for all income raised and spent we are not going to get honesty and grown up politics in Scotland.

 

[southfieldhibby]

#SNPGood #SNPNotToBeQuestioned

Just for good balance....

Here's my honest tuppence worth being serious... Being in government brings touch choices. And I've now concluded that until our Scottish Government has full control and responsibility for all income raised and spent we are not going to get honesty and grown up politics in Scotland.

Federal UK? FUK? No chance.IMO.

 

[aggie]

Our schools are so decrepit they are literally killing our children

Even for you - hyperbole much?!!!

#SNPGood #SNPNotToBeQuestioned

Just for good balance....

Here's my honest tuppence worth being serious... Being in government brings touch choices. And I've now concluded that until our Scottish Government has full control and responsibility for all income raised and spent we are not going to get honesty and grown up politics in Scotland.

Finally! You're on board! Can I count on you to doorstep with me during the next referendum? [emoji6]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[southfieldhibby]

Just had a quick dig about re:CalMac.

Looks like according to EU directive 90/351 insists that public utilities: the energy, telecommunications, transport and water sectors are now governed by EU produrement law. Derek McKay pretty much admitted that this goverment- and all the ones preceding- opposed this legal EU requirement, but it was obligated to do so.

Further rapid google searches confirm that SERCO will prob slash jobs in the search for profits, but any holyrood govt is effectively hamstrung to allow it. East Coast rail also.

This kinda rings a bell wrt to the recent tendering of water to Anglia too. ANY govt at Holyrood would be bound by EU legislation to tender, giving ANY opposition the opportunity to snipe away.

This, along with a few other recent events kinda veers me towards voting to leave The EU.

 

[The__Proclaimer]

Even for you - hyperbole much!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Pupil, 12, dies after wall collapses at Liberton High School - BBC News

 

[aggie]

Pupil, 12, dies after wall collapses at Liberton High School - BBC News

I get what you're referring to - I'm saying that taking that incident and conflating that into saying "schools are literally killing our children" is hyperbole worthy of the Daily Mail.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[paigntonhibby]

CalMac Ferry workers strike against SNP privatisation

2 July, 2015 - 09:48


RMT members employed by Caledonian MacBrayne (CalMac) staged three days of industrial action, including a one-day strike, in the last week of June.

A ballot on industrial action held the preceding month had seen a massive majority vote for action: 92% for strike action, and 98% of action short of a strike, on a 60% turnout. The vote was so overwhelming that it passed the requirements of the Tories’ new anti-union legislation.

The dispute centres of the threat to jobs, pensions and working conditions resulting from the fact that the Clyde and Hebrides ferry services, currently provided by CalMac, have been put out to tender.

Tenders are to be submitted by December, with the result announced in May of next year.

Apart from CalMac, the international business-outsourcing company Serco is also bidding for the eight-year contract for the ferry services and the £1 billion a year funding that goes with it.

In 2012 Serco beat CalMac to win the contract for the Northern Isles ferry services – and then promptly attacked staffing levels and the pensions and terms and conditions of employment of the CalMac employees transferred into Serco.

Serco also recently took over the Caledonian Sleeper rail service from Scotland to London in another tendering process run by the SNP Scottish government (which also saw Scottish domestic rail services handed over to Abellio).

The RMT, to which around half of CalMac’s 1,400 workforce belongs, is demanding guarantees that, whoever wins the Clyde and Hebrides contract, there will be no compulsory redundancies, and pensions and terms and conditions of employment will be preserved.

The SNP government – which is overseeing the tendering process, as well as being the sole shareholder in David MacBrayne Ltd., of which CalMac is a subsidiary – has repeatedly refused to give such assurances.

Instead, its Transport Minister, David Mackay, has claimed that the tendering process – despite the risk of Serco winning the contract – does not amount to privatisation!

As RMT General Secretary Mick Cash responded: “It is extraordinary that rather than standing up for Scotland’s lifeline ferry services, those who hold political power have resorted to ludicrous arguments about what does and doesn’t represent privatisation.”

The SNP government has also claimed that EU rules oblige it to periodically put Scottish ferry services out to tender, although transport unions and the Scottish TUC have consistently argued that this is not the case.

With no movement from the SNP government in response to the RMT ballot result, RMT members staged a two-day work-to-rule followed by a 24-hour strike in the last week of June.

SNP Deputy First Minister praised Calmac’s response to the strike, saying that it had done a “commendable job” in allegedly ensuring there were sufficient services to carry 40% of normal passenger capacity during the strike.

The TSSA, which claims to represent around a hundred CalMac office staff, is currently also balloting its members.

The RMT’s industrial action also triggered a statement from the SNP Trade Union Group, which largely consisted of a series of homilies about good working conditions and the role of the SNP government in standing up for Scotland’s interests in Europe.

The response from the RMT was brief and to the point:

"This statement from a group claiming to represent trade unionists makes not a single mention of support for fellow trade unionists battling to defend jobs and services.

Instead, it hides behind a barrage of EU anti-worker legislation that has no relevance at all to this dispute and which could be challenged anyway with a united campaign.

You can't claim to be anti-austerity, pro-working-class and pro-public-services and then duck the issue when jobs and services are under all-out attack like on CalMac. The question to the SNP TU Group is: which side are you o‎n?"

- - - Updated - - -



By the way the RMT are not affiliated to the Labour Party and do not back it financially.

BIG G

hope even your no' trying tae blame the SNP for this one G. EU directive that a government of any persuasion wid be legally bound tae conform tae

 

[HenryLB]

This, along with a few other recent events kinda veers me towards voting to leave The EU.

I don't think it will take much to get others, particularly in Scotland, thinking the same way. I actually have a feeling that to a certain extent the EU IN/Out battle lines will be redrawn, with In seeming increasingly like the choice of business and centralists who want to dominate small countries. If that happens I can even see a scenario - remote, but possible - where Scotland votes to leave and rUk opts to stay. I wonder what would happen then.

 

[southfieldhibby]

I don't think it will take much to get others, particularly in Scotland, thinking the same way. I actually have a feeling that to a certain extent the EU IN/Out battle lines will be redrawn, with In seeming increasingly like the choice of business and centralists who want to dominate small countries. If that happens I can even see a scenario - remote, but possible - where Scotland votes to leave and rUk opts to stay. I wonder what would happen then.

I'll eat my hat Henry.

I think I was probably about as pro european as you could be up until recently.I liked the idea of being an indy Scotland within a EU set up.To a degree I still do.But these tendering rules are ridiculous, TTiP is dreadful, the handling of the immigrant disaster is/was bad, the move to the right in places like Hungary looks well dodgy, and the political situation in Portugal was undemocratic and yet fully acceptable to Brussels it seems to me?

 

[HenryLB]

I'll eat my hat Henry.

I think I was probably about as pro european as you could be up until recently.I liked the idea of being an indy Scotland within a EU set up.To a degree I still do.But these tendering rules are ridiculous, TTiP is dreadful, the handling of the immigrant disaster is/was bad, the move to the right in places like Hungary looks well dodgy, and the political situation in Portugal was undemocratic and yet fully acceptable to Brussels it seems to me?

Haha, well just a few months ago I'd have eaten my hat. But I reckon a lot more will start to see things your way. The Greece situation - and the other stuff you point out - changed a lot of people's minds about the EU.

Previously I thought the anti-EU drive would have been a bunch of stale Ukip types and fringe tories rattling on about the queen, but I now feel we are going to see a campaign that's a lot more 'positive' and varied politically. They will have learned a lot from the Yes campaign in Scotland as well. No had to defend a pretty stale, easily criticised status quo against 'change', and the In message will have to do the same.

 

[Sunshine on Leith]

...also taking the worse case of each point as true... I have absolutely no confidence that any scottish party in Scotland would be better.

...strong opposition is a necessity and in the devolved parlament the UK parties LibLabCon seem hamstrung while they are at odds with there UK equivalents.

- - - Updated - - -



Not a critism of your point...is that Edinburgh only. .. Glasgow has rebuilt loads?

So has Edinburgh.

The school i work at has also just been granted the build of a brand new gym hall at the cost i believe £250,000 that will be a great addition towards the kids education.

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Pupil, 12, dies after wall collapses at Liberton High School - BBC News

Are you aware of how this wall happened to collapse?

 

[southfieldhibby]

Haha, well just a few months ago I'd have eaten my hat. But I reckon a lot more will start to see things your way. The Greece situation - and the other stuff you point out - changed a lot of people's minds about the EU.

Previously I thought the anti-EU drive would have been a bunch of stale Ukip types and fringe tories rattling on about the queen, but I now feel we are going to see a campaign that's a lot more 'positive' and varied politically. They will have learned a lot from the Yes campaign in Scotland as well. No had to defend a pretty stale, easily criticised status quo against 'change', and the In message will have to do the same.

The problem facing the 'out' brigade is no political party to back it.Tories won't officially, neither will Labour or SNP. They'll have no machine behind them. 'In' will win by plenty imo.

 

[HenryLB]

The problem facing the 'out' brigade is no political party to back it.Tories won't officially, neither will Labour or SNP. They'll have no machine behind them. 'In' will win by plenty imo.

True. Although the leader of the Labour Party apparently backs it.

I'm not saying everyone's suddenly going to start wanting to get out, just that I think the constituency that eventually makes up the Out vote, and the means by which it gets there, might be rather different than I - and I think quite a few others - originally thought.

 

[Jack]

I think the EU is a wonderful thing that's got a wee bit carried away with its own importance. I agree with those who suggest a change, possibly a step change, in the way it operates is essential and not just for the UK.

We'll see how the Torys get on with that.

The one thing I doubt we'll see is a change to the directive that put public utilities out to tender. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that was a Tory proposal that originally brought that about ;-)

 

[Braehead Cabbage]

Our schools are so decrepit they are literally killing our children but it's much easier to blame the English than make unpopular decisions.

Whilst I realise there was a tragedy with the girl in Edinburgh,was it just that school or are all Edinburgh schools in poor condition?
Where I live all the high schools have been re built and I can look out my window and watch the new primary school on Cowie being built

 

[Plasticman]

I'll eat my hat Henry.

I think I was probably about as pro european as you could be up until recently.I liked the idea of being an indy Scotland within a EU set up.To a degree I still do.But these tendering rules are ridiculous, TTiP is dreadful, the handling of the immigrant disaster is/was bad, the move to the right in places like Hungary looks well dodgy, and the political situation in Portugal was undemocratic and yet fully acceptable to Brussels it seems to me?

Pretty much describes my thoughts too