13000 ST holders, zero opinions heard....unanimous?

**SKII** · 16-09-17, 17:42

Banner for our reps and Board said it all.

**Faughnan** · 16-09-17, 17:46

No matter what you think about the boards statement or the whole situation in general, those banners were spot on.

**SKII** · 16-09-17, 17:53

Originally Posted by Faughnan

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No matter what you think about the boards statement or the whole situation in general, those banners were spot on.

The reps could have abstained from the vote. They hadn't canvassed opinion. They forgot their job. They seem not to appreciate the problem here.

NW · 16-09-17, 17:53

Yes it's spot on. We get polled about strip colours but our views about important tooofa and the whole integrity of our games are not welcome

**Jack** · 16-09-17, 18:02

Originally Posted by NW

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Yes it's spot on. We get polled about strip colours but our views about important tooofa and the whole integrity of our games are not welcome

We probably wouldn't understand.

NW · 16-09-17, 18:04

Originally Posted by Jack

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We probably wouldn't understand.

Of course we wouldn't , too complex.

**DarrenSQH** · 16-09-17, 18:15

If there was banners about me at games then I would think about my position.

**SKII** · 16-09-17, 18:16

Originally Posted by DarrenSQH

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If there was banners about me at games then I would think about my position.

You'd reckon so wouldnt you

**westsidehibs** · 16-09-17, 18:36

We sit right beside Frank a few folk weren't missing him the day.

**1875** · 16-09-17, 18:50

I told Frank exactly what me and the majority of fans on the bounce who actually post an opinion feel about the statement and their role in it today at half time as some may have witnessed.

I didnt personalise it, Frank and Tracey are good Hibbys. I told him I think he and Tracey are patsies, I told him they have got this badly wrong, I told him I personally have not felt as badly about the club since relegation, they have spoiled three years of good work, we have went back ten years with this statement, I told him this is not simply about the Huns, this is about finding out what went on at the SFA and the other parties that allowed this situation to arise? I asked him if he and Tracey were Fans Reps to the board or Board Reps to the Fans. He confirmed they are Fans Reps to the Board, I told him that is not how we see them and repeated my disappointment.

Interestingly I saw very few others engage with him before, during and after the game?

It is important to say, I consider Frank a friend but I think his and Tracey's position is untenable to Hibs fans.

He promised to feed it back to the board. I told him it was too late.

**baggageandfibs** · 16-09-17, 19:05

well said 1875

**HibeeZab** · 16-09-17, 19:08

Nobody has actually polled season ticket holders, so the fans representatives and the banner today are both totally inaccurate as they actually represent no one, only assumed opionions.

**SKII** · 16-09-17, 19:09

Originally Posted by HibeeZab

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Nobody has actually polled season ticket holders, so the fans representatives and the banner toddy are both totally inaccurate.

The banner wasn't

**Greenpower** · 16-09-17, 19:13

Originally Posted by 1875

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I told Frank exactly what me and the majority of fans on the bounce who actually post an opinion feel about the statement and their role in it today at half time as some may have witnessed. I didnt personalise it, Frank and Tracey are good Hibbys. I told him I think he and Tracey are patsies, I told him they have got this badly wrong, I told him I personally have not felt as badly about the club since relegation, they have spoiled three years of good work, we have went back ten years with this statement, I told him this is not simply about the Huns, this is about finding out what went on at the SFA and the other parties that allowed this situation to arise? I asked him if he and Tracey were Fans Reps to the board or Board Reps to the Fans. He confirmed they are Fans Reps to the Board, I told him that is not how we see them and repeated my disappointment.Interestingly I saw very few others engage with him before, during and after the game?It is important to say, I consider Frank a friend but I think his and Tracey's position is untenable to Hibs fans.He promised to feed it back to the board. I told him it was too late.

Top post

**Purple & Green** · 16-09-17, 19:28

I’m still bemused that the board didn’t foresee the furore their stance and particularly the wording of the statement would cause.

I’ve reread the statement and it’s full of leaps of faith, especially in regard to how the sfa dealt with the whole sorry affair. Sorry, it’s going to be a long time before I frust the sfa.

NW · 16-09-17, 19:32

Originally Posted by Purple & Green

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I’m still bemused that the board didn’t foresee the furore their stance and particularly the wording of the statement would cause.

I’ve reread the statement and it’s full of leaps of faith, especially in regard to how the sfa dealt with the whole sorry affair. Sorry, it’s going to be a long time before I frust the sfa.

They don't care so they would see no need to foresee it

**Robert Barone** · 16-09-17, 19:44

In the end neither the Fans Reps or the Board give a flying **** what we think. The matter is closed for both - how the Reps can continue takes a special kind of brass neck and the excuses afterwards were frankly insulting to our intelligence.

I've no confidence in the Reps and would suggest that representations are made to the Board thru the Supporters Associations that we want them voted down thru a no confidence vote. Anything else is entirely pointless imo as neither will resign as they refuse to see the obvious betrayal of supporters trust they perpetrated.

I'll not be renewing my season ticket next season or attending games, for me that is how strongly I feel. I understand others won't want to do that and the reason why but for me it's the only way I feel I can show my utter disgust at the custodians of the club and the snake like Reps.

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**Smurf** · 16-09-17, 19:53

Originally Posted by 1875

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I told Frank exactly what me and the majority of fans on the bounce who actually post an opinion feel about the statement and their role in it today at half time as some may have witnessed.

I didnt personalise it, Frank and Tracey are good Hibbys. I told him I think he and Tracey are patsies, I told him they have got this badly wrong, I told him I personally have not felt as badly about the club since relegation, they have spoiled three years of good work, we have went back ten years with this statement, I told him this is not simply about the Huns, this is about finding out what went on at the SFA and the other parties that allowed this situation to arise? I asked him if he and Tracey were Fans Reps to the board or Board Reps to the Fans. He confirmed they are Fans Reps to the Board, I told him that is not how we see them and repeated my disappointment.

Interestingly I saw very few others engage with him before, during and after the game?

It is important to say, I consider Frank a friend but I think his and Tracey's position is untenable to Hibs fans.

He promised to feed it back to the board. I told him it was too late.

10/10.

Both need to walk.

**baggageandfibs** · 16-09-17, 19:54

Originally Posted by Robert Barone

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In the end neither the Fans Reps or the Board give a flying **** what we think. The matter is closed for both - how the Reps can continue takes a special kind of brass neck and the excuses afterwards were frankly insulting to our intelligence.

I've no confidence in the Reps and would suggest that representations are made to the Board thru the Supporters Associations that we want them voted down thru a no confidence vote. Anything else is entirely pointless imo as neither will resign as they refuse to see the obvious betrayal of supporters trust they perpetrated.

I'll not be renewing my season ticket next season or attending games, for me that is how strongly I feel. I understand others won't want to do that and the reason why but for me it's the only way I feel I can show my utter disgust at the custodians of the club and the snake like Reps.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Feeling the same way. Can't see me renewing next year. Was feeling a bit under the weather today, so didn't go. Would normally need to have a leg hanging off to stop me. Definitely lost my Hibs mojo at the moment.

**bigmanandy** · 16-09-17, 20:46

And still people moaned about the banner, 'too much like the green brigade' from the west stand prawns.

Well done, $#@! the board.

**SKII** · 16-09-17, 20:59

Originally Posted by bigmanandy

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And still people moaned about the banner, 'too much like the green brigade' from the west stand prawns.

Well done, $#@! the board.

Nothing beats a good old hyperbolic sweeping generalisation, eh? Which West Stand Prawns? 1875? Gunner? Broonieboy? Me?

**bigmanandy** · 16-09-17, 21:02

Originally Posted by SKII

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Nothing beats a good old hyperbolic sweeping generalisation, eh? Which West Stand Prawns? 1875? Gunner? Broonieboy? Me?

Was at the North side of the West, couple daftys behind me.

**SKII** · 16-09-17, 21:06

Originally Posted by bigmanandy

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Was at the North side of the West, couple daftys behind me.

So, two people you didn't agree with. That's all that needed saying then

**bigmanandy** · 16-09-17, 21:07

Originally Posted by SKII

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So, two people you didn't agree with. That's all that needed saying then

Fair enough.

**Sir Shrink** · 16-09-17, 22:44

There was a boy in the ff upper who was a bit of a tit too.

Should probably close it

Or me

**broonieboy** · 16-09-17, 22:45

Originally Posted by SKII

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Nothing beats a good old hyperbolic sweeping generalisation, eh? Which West Stand Prawns? 1875? Gunner? Broonieboy? Me?

This West Stand P(r)awn was in total agreement with the display. Calm doon Mandy, dinnae throw us all tae the lions.

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**SlovSam** · 16-09-17, 23:03

Originally Posted by 1875

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I told Frank exactly what me and the majority of fans on the bounce who actually post an opinion feel about the statement and their role in it today at half time as some may have witnessed.

I didnt personalise it, Frank and Tracey are good Hibbys. I told him I think he and Tracey are patsies, I told him they have got this badly wrong, I told him I personally have not felt as badly about the club since relegation, they have spoiled three years of good work, we have went back ten years with this statement, I told him this is not simply about the Huns, this is about finding out what went on at the SFA and the other parties that allowed this situation to arise? I asked him if he and Tracey were Fans Reps to the board or Board Reps to the Fans. He confirmed they are Fans Reps to the Board, I told him that is not how we see them and repeated my disappointment.

Interestingly I saw very few others engage with him before, during and after the game?

It is important to say, I consider Frank a friend but I think his and Tracey's position is untenable to Hibs fans.

He promised to feed it back to the board. I told him it was too late.

Absolutely this.

Very impressed by the guys who organised this protest/statement.

No comment is required on the "Fan reps" lets just leave it there.

**HibeeZab** · 16-09-17, 23:05

Originally Posted by SKII

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The banner wasn't

I'm one of 13000 Season tickets holders and no one has officially ask my opinion so aye if is.

**Sir Shrink** · 16-09-17, 23:09

I don't think the fans reps are patsies at all.

They did what they thought was correct. Nobody manipulated them.

It's the SFA that need looked at, not our reps.

The guys that are chucking Hibs over this..,... I'm sure you mean well.

**EastMeetsWest** · 16-09-17, 23:23

Originally Posted by bigmanandy

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And still people moaned about the banner, 'too much like the green brigade' from the west stand prawns.

Well done, $#@! the board.

Really ? Never heard any disagreement from the west stand. About time stopped pushing blame on fans that like myself turn up week in week out to support the club.

The big picture is that Scottish football is the most unattractive investment for sponsors and we are never going to get over it with in house fighting. As much as it is contrived and geared to the ugly sisters, we need to rise above it. How many clubs have suffered 2nd tier football for 3 seasons and turned up with the crowds we have.

But on point, 2 English cants at the head of SFA speaks volumes.

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**SKII** · 16-09-17, 23:31

Originally Posted by HibeeZab

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I'm one of 13000 Season tickets holders and no one has officially ask my opinion so aye if is.

That's what the banner said though? So aye it's right...youve confirmed it.

**Jack** · 16-09-17, 23:58

Originally Posted by 1875

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I told Frank exactly what me and the majority of fans on the bounce who actually post an opinion feel about the statement and their role in it today at half time as some may have witnessed.

I didnt personalise it, Frank and Tracey are good Hibbys. I told him I think he and Tracey are patsies, I told him they have got this badly wrong, I told him I personally have not felt as badly about the club since relegation, they have spoiled three years of good work, we have went back ten years with this statement, I told him this is not simply about the Huns, this is about finding out what went on at the SFA and the other parties that allowed this situation to arise? I asked him if he and Tracey were Fans Reps to the board or Board Reps to the Fans. He confirmed they are Fans Reps to the Board, I told him that is not how we see them and repeated my disappointment.

Interestingly I saw very few others engage with him before, during and after the game?

It is important to say, I consider Frank a friend but I think his and Tracey's position is untenable to Hibs fans.

He promised to feed it back to the board. I told him it was too late.

Well said.

I'm almost more interested in his response.

- - - Updated - - -

Originally Posted by Purple & Green

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I’m still bemused that the board didn’t foresee the furore their stance and particularly the wording of the statement would cause.

I’ve reread the statement and it’s full of leaps of faith, especially in regard to how the sfa dealt with the whole sorry affair. Sorry, it’s going to be a long time before I frust the sfa.

I'm not sure I ever trusted them. It was always a hope they wouldn't $#@! me/Hibs over completely. Little did I ever realise we'd $#@! ourselves over!

The next big test will be if sevco are in Europe next year on accounts written on the back of a fag packet.

If Hibs are out because of something like this, as clubs have been in the past, then so am I.

- - - Updated - - -

Originally Posted by Sir Shrink

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I don't think the fans reps are patsies at all.

They did what they thought was correct. Nobody manipulated them.

It's the SFA that need looked at, not our reps.

The guys that are chucking Hibs over this..,... I'm sure you mean well.

While I agree I'd like to see the evidence which made our reps vote against the overwhelming wish of those who elected them.

I think that would be fair.

**kevinc** · 17-09-17, 00:21

Originally Posted by Sir Shrink

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I don't think the fans reps are patsies at all.

They did what they thought was correct. Nobody manipulated them.

It's the SFA that need looked at, not our reps.

The guys that are chucking Hibs over this..,... I'm sure you mean well.

Disagree, I think they have been manipulated by the board, they have not represented the fans that they are mandated to represent as far as I can see. Dont know much about Tracey except what I have seen at th WT meetings, my impression is that she is keen to be popular. FD is a disappointment for me, all mouth and nae troosers(as my granny would say), blazer chaser; he will not give up his role and will stand for a third tenure if he can.

I fully expect Rodders to bag a senior SFA role in the medium term and LD to get a job closer to home, phuck them.

**barney** · 17-09-17, 02:32

I'm totally confused as to why everyone is getting so excited about this.
Scottish fitba is $#@!.
But Hibs won the cup.

**SuperTortolano** · 17-09-17, 04:26

Originally Posted by Sir Shrink

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I don't think the fans reps are patsies at all.

They did what they thought was correct. Nobody manipulated them.

It's the SFA that need looked at, not our reps.

The guys that are chucking Hibs over this..,... I'm sure you mean well.

If they aren't patsies they are completely incompetent.

FANS REP. That means they represent the fans. They didn't represent even close to the majority of fans.

Those are the facts. Whatever words are used to describe them is irrelevant, they didn't do there job.

**baggageandfibs** · 17-09-17, 08:37

Originally Posted by Sir Shrink

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I don't think the fans reps are patsies at all.

They did what they thought was correct. Nobody manipulated them.

It's the SFA that need looked at, not our reps.

The guys that are chucking Hibs over this..,... I'm sure you mean well.

Not sure you're seeing the bigger picture here. It's corrupt Scottish football I'm prepared to chuck. At least I used to be able to cling to the naive belief that Hibs were one of the good guys. If they can't do what's right for the game and are prepared to accept their bit part in the circus of Scottish fitba then don't be surprised if people find other things to do with their time and money.

**Greenpower** · 26-09-17, 17:01

Originally Posted by SuperTortolano

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If they aren't patsies they are completely incompetent. FANS REP. That means they represent the fans. They didn't represent even close to the majority of fans. Those are the facts. Whatever words are used to describe them is irrelevant, they didn't do there job.

It would be helpful if @traceyhibs could confirm what thier job / role is

**lespenny** · 26-09-17, 17:42

Originally Posted by Sir Shrink

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I don't think the fans reps are patsies at all.

They did what they thought was correct. Nobody manipulated them.

It's the SFA that need looked at, not our reps.

The guys that are chucking Hibs over this..,... I'm sure you mean well.

Sorry Shrink, don't think I've ever posted a disagreement with you before but - every single time that a Fan Rep casts a vote, that vote must represent the voice of the supporters not their own opinion. A simple poll would have told them, in no uncertain terms, what the majority thought of the board's intended reply. As it stands there is absolutely no point in having "Fan Representation" if it doesn't represent them!
I'm sorry to say it but they both have to go and Leanne must state categorically what the term "Fan Representation"means and what responsibilities it carries. If this outline does not match what their previous rhetoric promised then we have all been mislead and would need to start over..

**Jack** · 26-09-17, 18:11

Originally Posted by lespenny

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Sorry Shrink, don't think I've ever posted a disagreement with you before but - every single time that a Fan Rep casts a vote, that vote must represent the voice of the supporters not their own opinion. A simple poll would have told them, in no uncertain terms, what the majority thought of the board's intended reply. As it stands there is absolutely no point in having "Fan Representation" if it doesn't represent them!
I'm sorry to say it but they both have to go and Leanne must state categorically what the term "Fan Representation"means and what responsibilities it carries. If this outline does not match what their previous rhetoric promised then we have all been mislead and would need to start over..

I'm not going to disagree with the gist of this. Where would you put the poll though?

The Bounce?
Dotnet?
Any one or all of the various Facebook pages?
Any one or all of the various Twitter accounts?
Any or all of the official media sites?

What about those with no, or little, access to t'internet?

**Duns_Hibby** · 26-09-17, 18:14

Originally Posted by Jack

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I'm not going to disagree with the gist of this. Where would you put the poll though?

The Bounce?
Dotnet?
Any one or all of the various Facebook pages?
Any one or all of the various Twitter accounts?
Any or all of the official media sites?

What about those with no, or little, access to t'internet?

Don't think it matters as our 'reps' have been gagged and any response would be a corporate one. Imposters.

**Jack** · 26-09-17, 18:16

Originally Posted by Duns_Hibby

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Don't think it matters as our 'reps' have been gagged and any response would be a corporate one. Imposters.

I was making the point a "simple poll" perhaps wasn't that simple.

**Duns_Hibby** · 26-09-17, 18:21

Originally Posted by Jack

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I was making the point a "simple poll" perhaps wasn't that simple.

I agree with that, but at the end of the day it doesn't matter as, whether simple or complex, the response will be the same and will have nothing to do with our board stooges - they will just be the fall guys to justify it.....a 'shield' for the decision-makers who continue to pay only lip-service to fans.

**paul 1875** · 26-09-17, 18:35

Originally Posted by Jack

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I'm not going to disagree with the gist of this. Where would you put the poll though?

The Bounce?
Dotnet?
Any one or all of the various Facebook pages?
Any one or all of the various Twitter accounts?
Any or all of the official media sites?

What about those with no, or little, access to t'internet?

why could`nt the club send a letter to all season tickets holders telling us how they where going to reply to this and if we where not happy they could have had some kind of poll through your season ticket number so they know it was one of the 13000 season ticket holders .

**Greenpower** · 26-09-17, 19:14

Originally Posted by lespenny

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Sorry Shrink, don't think I've ever posted a disagreement with you before but - every single time that a Fan Rep casts a vote, that vote must represent the voice of the supporters not their own opinion. A simple poll would have told them, in no uncertain terms, what the majority thought of the board's intended reply. As it stands there is absolutely no point in having "Fan Representation" if it doesn't represent them!I'm sorry to say it but they both have to go and Leanne must state categorically what the term "Fan Representation"means and what responsibilities it carries. If this outline does not match what their previous rhetoric promised then we have all been mislead and would need to start over..

Top post. Can't believe they haven't resigned.

**Jack** · 26-09-17, 19:42

Originally Posted by paul 1875

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why could`nt the club send a letter to all season tickets holders telling us how they where going to reply to this and if we where not happy they could have had some kind of poll through your season ticket number so they know it was one of the 13000 season ticket holders .

Although apparently integrity has no cost, I suspect the cost!

**Sir Shrink** · 26-09-17, 21:25

Originally Posted by lespenny

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Sorry Shrink, don't think I've ever posted a disagreement with you before but - every single time that a Fan Rep casts a vote, that vote must represent the voice of the supporters not their own opinion. A simple poll would have told them, in no uncertain terms, what the majority thought of the board's intended reply. As it stands there is absolutely no point in having "Fan Representation" if it doesn't represent them!
I'm sorry to say it but they both have to go and Leanne must state categorically what the term "Fan Representation"means and what responsibilities it carries. If this outline does not match what their previous rhetoric promised then we have all been mislead and would need to start over..

We're not that far apart.............

I've never been a fan of the 'fans on the Board' because of the inevitability that things like this would happen.
Just as MPs and MSPs (for example) represent their constituents, sometimes they will vote against the wishes of those who put them there. Support for capital punishment for example will never be given by the reps even if the constituency is firmly in favour.

It's also pretty rare for 'votes' to be taken on Boards in the main. It's usually debate and consensus, with Board members then taking corporate responsibility - or if they can't - resigning.
It appears from the little we know that Frank and Tracey more than likely would have known the majority of Hibs fans wanted action not inaction, and no doubt expressed that view as our reps. They were then persuaded by legal advice and 'other information or argument' that it was not in the best interests of Hibs to pursue it. Their legal obligation as directors is to act in the best interest of THE CLUB and if that contradicts our view then that's that really.

So, in a nutshell - Frank and Tracey took the consensus view and (maybe reluctantly - who knows?) have to accept responsibility for it.

I agree that they have not taken the fans view (poll or no poll) on board, they have reacted to the information presented to them. Without knowing what it was, I can't say if it was pragmatic or not.

What I'm pretty clear about is that neither of them were co-erced, manipulated, bribed or threatened by the Ogre Petrie - and neither did the Board make them 'Patsies' or 'hang them out to dry'. The Board gave a 'unanimous view' because that's what strong Boards do. Had it been otherwise, then I agree Tracey and Frank would have to stand down - that's in my experience of corporate governance anyway.

And finally......................... you are spot on about how the role should have been clearly defined and explained. It's difficult to lay out a template that references when supporters should be consulted, but perhaps this was a bit of a glaring example of just such an instance.

Oh aye, and finally finally.......... we should remember where the blame really lies. Folk like Campbell Ogilvie, Gordon Smith, Stewart Regan are the ones we rightly blame.
Frank and Tracey not so much.

Bugger................ one last point.............. I don't know if they have indeed been 'gagged' or whether they have just decided themselves to bugger off for a while, but the communication - or lack of it - has made a difficult situation disastrous.

NW · 26-09-17, 22:22

Originally Posted by Jack

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Although apparently integrity has no cost, I suspect the cost!

It didn't cost too much I am guessing to give us a say on strip colour. They didn't want our opinion , their stance has been clear for some time.

**beefy** · 27-09-17, 10:42

Do the so called fans reps enjoy the privilege of being so? $#@!in right they do!

2 years time or whenever just dinnae vote peeps. It won't matter cos it will still carry on regardless. And it still won't mean a thing. They don't represent. They don't even try to represent.

Pure folly.