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Thread: Two Players To Change Our Season

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    Two Players To Change Our Season

    For me it has to be Hendo and Dobbie, although I think NL will want another LB

    Reading the interview with Hendo in the EN he certainly sounds positive about coming back and I hope this time the Smellies don't $#@! it up for us

    could certainly do with him right now especially on how many corners were brutal yesterday. Get in done!!

    Dobbie would get us much needed goals and is a much better option than Holt or Graham.
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    As I have said on another thread it is all down to Celtic whether or not they are willing to let Henderson go. The player himself stated in the summer he didn't want to go out on loan again. If Celtic are willing to sell and Hibs have the money then great..let's do it. Not convinced it will happen in January but maybe next summer.

    Lennon had Dobbie at Bolton yet still wasn't prepared to bring him to ER in the summer. Has his opinion changed now ? If he did sign Dobbie then I doubt it would be to replace either Holt or Graham who are both very different types of forwards to Dobbie. He may of course decide to let Cummings go if we get a big offer in January, but I hope he doesn't as for me it would be suicidal to let your top goalscorer leave half way through a season.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greenmachine View Post
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    As I have said on another thread it is all down to Celtic whether or not they are willing to let Henderson go. The player himself stated in the summer he didn't want to go out on loan again. If Celtic are willing to sell and Hibs have the money then great..let's do it. Not convinced it will happen in January but maybe next summer.

    Lennon had Dobbie at Bolton yet still wasn't prepared to bring him to ER in the summer. Has his opinion changed now ? If he did sign Dobbie then I doubt it would be to replace either Holt or Graham who are both very different types of forwards to Dobbie. He may of course decide to let Cummings go if we get a big offer in January, but I hope he doesn't as for me it would be suicidal to let your top goalscorer leave half way through a season.
    We should be buying Hendo GM and Dobbie TBH I couldn't think of any reason why NL didn't bring Dobbie in instead of Holt to be honest, if you compare the two both have experience, Dobbie for me looks fitter and his goal ratio stands out more than Holts. NL fought tooth and nail to get him to Bolton. Hendo wants to come to us on a permanent deal and IMHO I think these additions would get more erses on seats.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Family View Post
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    We should be buying Hendo GM and Dobbie TBH I couldn't think of any reason why NL didn't bring Dobbie in instead of Holt to be honest, if you compare the two both have experience, Dobbie for me looks fitter and his goal ratio stands out more than Holts. NL fought tooth and nail to get him to Bolton. Hendo wants to come to us on a permanent deal and IMHO I think these additions would get more erses on seats.
    Dobbie and Holt totally different players. Lenny wanted a target man Holt does that very well. We don't have runners from midfield to take advantage of that. Plus service from wide areas is very poor. Struggling to think who in squad consistently puts in decent crosses

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greenpower View Post
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    Dobbie and Holt totally different players. Lenny wanted a target man Holt does that very well. We don't have runners from midfield to take advantage of that. Plus service from wide areas is very poor. Struggling to think who in squad consistently puts in decent crosses
    Holt is a striker his job is to score goals, as I mentioned previously Dobbie has a much better goal ratio which is something we are lacking.



    Dobbie and Cummings would work.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Family View Post
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    Holt is a striker his job is to score goals, as I mentioned previously Dobbie has a much better goal ratio which is something we are lacking.Dobbie and Cummings would work.
    Striker has many jobs. Lenny wanted physical presence hence Holt. Cummings will find his shooting boots again and Will easily out score anyone in this league

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greenpower View Post
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    Striker has many jobs. Lenny wanted physical presence hence Holt. Cummings will find his shooting boots again and Will easily out score anyone in this league
    Sorry we need strikers who can get us goals.

    Holt 8 appearances 2 goals.

    Dobbie 10 appearances 6 goals.

    It's goals that get us promoted not ground work.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Family View Post
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    Sorry we need strikers who can get us goals.Holt 8 appearances 2 goals.Dobbie 10 appearances 6 goals.It's goals that get us promoted not ground work.
    Holt was a rock at Ayr which set us up for victory.QOS miles off top of league.We need runners from midfield which break the lines. Pat Miginlay type.Wasn't holts fault we didn't win yesterday

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greenpower View Post
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    Holt was a rock at Ayr which set us up for victory.QOS miles off top of league.We need runners from midfield which break the lines. Pat Miginlay type.Wasn't holts fault we didn't win yesterday
    How many goals did he score at Ayr...
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Family View Post
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    How many goals did he score at Ayr...
    What's your point? We won

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greenpower View Post
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    What's your point? We won

    Holt doesn't score enough, I don't want to lose out on promotion because we failed to score goals to kill teams off like yesterday.

    Or would you be happy with never mind Holt was a rock for us.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Family View Post
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    Sorry we need strikers who can get us goals.

    Holt 8 appearances 2 goals.

    Dobbie 10 appearances 6 goals.

    It's goals that get us promoted not ground work.
    Holt has scored three times I think, v Morton, St Mirren and the Pars
    until the sky turns green

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    Quote Originally Posted by tricky View Post
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    Holt has scored three times I think, v Morton, St Mirren and the Pars
    Still less than Dobbie mate.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Family View Post
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    Sorry we need strikers who can get us goals.

    Holt 8 appearances 2 goals.

    Dobbie 10 appearances 6 goals.

    It's goals that get us promoted not ground work.
    We need both - no point in having goalscorer on the park if there's no one around them to affect the play, draw defenders and create chances. Football isn't as simple as goalscorer=goals

    The problem we have is that we don't get enough players forward quickly enough - the midfield amble forward rather than drive at opposition defenders - and quality of the balls into the box, particularly from the left, is very poor.

    If we're going to play the 3412 formation, we need to improve on the delivery from left wing back, and allow John McGinn greater license join the attacks quicker. We already have the excellent Fraser Fyvie as the more defensive of the two midfielders, so there isn't a reason that McGinn can't get forward more.

    If we need to sign anyone in January, then Liam Henderson would be an excellent addition due the quality of his final ball and his willingness to attack from midfield. I'd suggest we also need to look to add a left wing back who can cross better than Lewis Stevenson.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by The Family View Post
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    Still less than Dobbie mate.
    Dobbie V Holt isn't the correct argument - if he had signed for Hibs it would have been to play alongside a target man like Holt or Graham as Stephen Dobbie isn't a physical presence, he's a goalscorer... So really he'd have come to Hibs to compete with Cummings, Keatings & Boyle for a starting place.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HibeeZab View Post
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    We need both - no point in having goalscorer on the park if there's no one around them to affect the play, draw defenders and create chances. Football isn't as simple as goalscorer=goals

    The problem we have is that we don't get enough players forward quickly enough - the midfield amble forward rather than drive at opposition defenders - and quality of the balls into the box, particularly from the left, is very poor.

    If we're going to play the 3412 formation, we need to improve on the delivery from left wing back, and allow John McGinn greater license join the attacks quicker. We already have the excellent Fraser Fyvie as the more defensive of the two midfielders, so there isn't a reason that McGinn can't get forward more.

    If we need to sign anyone in January, then Liam Henderson would be an excellent addition due the quality of his final ball and his willingness to attack from midfield. I'd suggest we also need to look to add a left wing back who can cross better than Lewis Stevenson.

    As mentioned above Holt doesn't score enough goals where Dobbie in the same league is, his goal ratio and Cummings would have us out of sight instead of missing chance after chance. The midfield should be creating for the strikers and as you have already pointed out we don't play with enough urgency or get good balls into the box. Hendo will massively improve us in this position if it happens. My point is we need goals to get us out of this league and we are missing too many chances for my liking. Yesterday was a great chance to create some width between us and Dundee United and we haven't taken it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Family View Post
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    As mentioned above Holt doesn't score enough goals where Dobbie in the same league is, his goal ratio and Cummings would have us out of sight instead of missing chance after chance. The midfield should be creating for the strikers and as you have already pointed out we don't play with enough urgency or get good balls into the box. Hendo will massively improve us in this position if it happens. My point is we need goals to get us out of this league and we are missing too many chances for my liking. Yesterday was a great chance to create some width between us and Dundee United and we haven't taken it.
    I get what you're saying, but I don't see Lennon playing without a target man, making it unlikely we'd see players like Cummings and Dobbie in the same starting eleven.

    The midfielder need to contribute more in terms of goals and chances, as you say Henderson would help us in that regard.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HibeeZab View Post
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    I get what you're saying, but I don't see Lennon playing without a target man, making it unlikely we'd see players like Cummings and Dobbie in the same starting eleven.

    The midfielder need to contribute more in terms of goals and chances, as you say Henderson would help us in that regard.
    taking away both Hartson and Sutton I can't think of anyone else you would call a target man in NL's set up.

    For me the target man slows our play down by hoof ball nonsense, give me fast flowing attacking football any day.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Family View Post
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    taking away both Hartson and Sutton I can't think of anyone else you would call a target man in NL's set up.

    For me the target man slows our play down by hoof ball nonsense, give me fast flowing attacking football any day.
    I'm not talking about what Neil Lennon has done at other clubs, I'm talking about the tactical approach he's deploying at Hibernian. I can only think of one league game he hasn't started with a target man, 1-1 versus Dundee United, which to me suggests he is favouring a physical presence up front.

    Normally I'd agree with the fast flowing football, but this season I couldn't care less as long as we win the league.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Family View Post
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    taking away both Hartson and Sutton I can't think of anyone else you would call a target man in NL's set up.

    For me the target man slows our play down by hoof ball nonsense, give me fast flowing attacking football any day.
    Do you deliberately no see peoples point just so ye can argue the toss? Seriously, try actually reading what others are saying before ye reply pish!

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Family View Post
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    Holt doesn't score enough, I don't want to lose out on promotion because we failed to score goals to kill teams off like yesterday.

    Or would you be happy with never mind Holt was a rock for us.
    Spot on I don't want promotion.


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    We never won a game when Holt was dropped. He came back and we started winning again. Seems pretty obvious he makes a positive contribution.

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    Holt is contributing more now but it's goals we need. The priority in Jan in the window must be to get more goals in this side. Otherwise we are again going to fail to get up.

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    I am now tending to the side of the argument that it's less goal scorers than ammo provided that is of most importance.

    Maybe Suarez could have done something with the shoulder height, rocket fast balls coming in from behind him which seemed to be most of what got near our strikers; but a Scottish second tier strike force is not regularly going to furnish the bicycle kicks or world class first touches required to convert such 'chances' into goals.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Smurf View Post
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    Holt is contributing more now but it's goals we need. The priority in Jan in the window must be to get more goals in this side. Otherwise we are again going to fail to get up.
    We have narrowed the pitch, and have no real width which Lennon seems to not mind. Given that, I would swap to a kind of 4-3-3 formation with Keatings and Cummings playing off of Holt/Graham

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    Have we narrowed the pitch? I really hope not. The slippery slope to guntball

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    Don't know about 2 players but 2 half decent officials might change our season, absolutley shocking so far and cost us points.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MixuDave View Post
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    Do you deliberately no see peoples point just so ye can argue the toss? Seriously, try actually reading what others are saying before ye reply pish!
    All I mentioned was Holt doesn't score enough, people are entitled to their opinion but that is mine.

    reply with your pish....LOL

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Greenpower View Post
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    Spot on I don't want promotion.


    Where does it mention that I said you didn't want promotion mate?
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Family View Post
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    All I mentioned was Holt doesn't score enough, people are entitled to their opinion but that is mine.reply with your pish....LOL- - - Updated - - -Where does it mention that I said you didn't want promotion mate?
    Looking at your post that's how it reads

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greenpower View Post
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    Looking at your post that's how it reads

    Not at all, all I said was I didn't want us missing out on promotion due to lack of goals.
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    Quote Originally Posted by southfieldhibby View Post
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    Have we narrowed the pitch? I really hope not. The slippery slope to guntball
    Yip. I'm amazed by this. Must admit that reflecting on Saturday and our lack of converting dominance into goals has left me thinking again we are heading for the play-offs. It isn't good enough.

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    Fairly confident we'll win the league. Then hopefully Lennon gets offered a job he cannae refuse elsewhere.

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    Quote Originally Posted by southfieldhibby View Post
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    Fairly confident we'll win the league. Then hopefully Lennon gets offered a job he cannae refuse elsewhere.
    I think we will win it as well because I just think our squad is stronger than any other clubs squad in this league. I don't think we are going to pull away though, I think we are going to be battling with Dundee United for the top spot from now until about March/April next year. We just don't have enough goals in this team, nor do we play a system which is going to get us goals on a regular basis in order to enable us to pull away and win the league by the same margin that Hearts and the Rangers did. If we do go up I think Lennon will stay for another year before moving on probably back down to England.

    Btw if the worst happens and we don't finish top and end up in the play-offs again IMO you can forget promotion...and it will also signal the end of Neil Lennon's managerial career. Don't think it's going to come to that though.
    "I can't stress enough how important it is to be in possession of the football - it is better to be the matador rather than the bull"

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    In response to the title thread, what's to change about our season?

    A reality check required by many methinks. Third of season done, W 8 D4 L1, that's league winning form, may be not "run away with it" league winning form but more than good enough to win this league.

    Lots of room for improvement but teams set up to stop us every week, home or away, Yes I am frustrated with the fact we should be further ahead but in the big scheme of things we are ticking along nicely. This is a frickin hard hard league.

    Grant Holt is playing well just now, anybody that understand football will recognise this. The goals will come for the big guy but that's not the only attribute he possesses. We need more contribution from our midfield on the goals front, plain and simple. As well as cutting out our lousy defending at set pieces.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Family View Post
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    All I mentioned was Holt doesn't score enough, people are entitled to their opinion but that is mine.

    reply with your pish....LOL

    Pish, much like yer Hendo pish aye 😉

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    Quote Originally Posted by southfieldhibby View Post
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    Have we narrowed the pitch? I really hope not. The slippery slope to guntball
    Certainly looked like we have done so massively on the East Stand side imo aye.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MixuDave View Post
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    Certainly looked like we have done so massively on the East Stand side imo aye.
    Didn't notice, but wasn't looking if you know what I mean. Hope not though, we've mocked various clubs for doing the very same.

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    I think we will win the league, mainly because our fears don't take into account our opponents enough. Qots had a good run, united are having a good run. United will have their tough times as queens are now having. We should have the depth to weather our own better over the piece. However it's by no means a done deal due to the goals problem. NL needs to take action in January if we are still labouring - more and more his Euro commitments over the summer look like they cost us a properly thought through bolstering of the team; I think Lennon may have jumped at what he assumed to be a softness up front without considering the supply angle sufficiently.

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    As Mickey Weir stated in the EEN, we need a winger who can cross. Lewis can't seem to get it going consistently, Harris is a bottle merchant, Carmichael is away, Boyle has been moved inside and McGinn aint a winger.

    Buy a winger, and get Cummings back on the pitch.

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    I get why we are favourites to go up. However, the pressure is on us and I'd imagine if we were Dundee Utd fans we'd be feeling confident. This is now our fourth consecutive season where we simply don't score enough. I'm sorry but last season I thought we looked like a side that would do well in the division we should be in. This season I'm not so sure. We need width and pace in January but more than anything else goals!

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    Quote Originally Posted by southfieldhibby View Post
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    get Cummings back on the pitch.
    Exactly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by southfieldhibby View Post
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    As Mickey Weir stated in the EEN, we need a winger who can cross. Lewis can't seem to get it going consistently, Harris is a bottle merchant, Carmichael is away, Boyle has been moved inside and McGinn aint a winger.

    Buy a winger, and get Cummings back on the pitch.
    Also get Keatings back and continue using him, as Lennon had started doing before his injury, to supply the ammo from set pieces. Best striker of a dead ball we have IMO.


    Think I might nip over to Gorgie Farm and count some Chickens before they've hatched

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    Quote Originally Posted by MixuDave View Post
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    Pish, much like yer Hendo pish aye ������

    - - - Updated - - -



    Certainly looked like we have done so massively on the East Stand side imo aye.

    Hendo pish let's hear it then gadgey.
    "THE HIBEES FAMILY"

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Family View Post
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    Hendo pish let's hear it then gadgey.
    Gadgey 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
    The words 'done deal' spring tae mind 😉

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    Are goals that much of a problem? Unfair 1-1 draws happen sometimes, but we have won games 4-0, 2-0, 3-0, 3-1 etc... this season and our GD is the best in the league. Obviously I'd like more (who wouldn't) but it's nowhere near the problem it was last year.

    I'd be inclined to agree with EGB and others who have suggested good service would get us the goals that would allow us to steamroll teams. Not necessarily a winger but a player who excels at crossing, dead balls and corners would be my shout.

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    our players who aren't gracing the pitch right now would walk into the first eleven of any other team in this division....and a decent whack of the first elevens of the team in the division above.


    6 England MF Marvin Bartley
    10 Scotland MF Dylan McGeouch
    19 Scotland FW James Keatings
    23 Scotland DF Jordon Forster
    29 Scotland FW Brian Graham
    35 Scotland FW Jason Cummings

    less so...

    33 Scotland MF Alex Harris
    26 Wales DF Neal Eardley
    14 Scotland MF Danny Handling

    in that list is 3 decent strikers (albeit Keatings is injured).

    my criticism is lennons reluctance to use subs...I love a HT sub, used to love it when mowbray used to mix it up with a HT sub, i think it lifts the crowd too. its a real worry that the leagues top striker is now not match fit playing only ten minutes here and there...
    follow the programme archive on twitter: http://twitter.com/hibsbollah

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Family View Post
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    All I mentioned was Holt doesn't score enough, people are entitled to their opinion but that is mine.

    - -




    Where does it mention that I said you didn't want promotion mate?
    Dobbie is on contract till 30/06/2018 will cost

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    Quote Originally Posted by RUFUS View Post
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    Dobbie is on contract till 30/06/2018 will cost
    think he was keen to finish up at QOS, possibly so he can carry on living in north west England, might be wrong.
    until the sky turns green

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    Quote Originally Posted by Two Headed Boy View Post
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    Are goals that much of a problem? Unfair 1-1 draws happen sometimes, but we have won games 4-0, 2-0, 3-0, 3-1 etc... this season and our GD is the best in the league. Obviously I'd like more (who wouldn't) but it's nowhere near the problem it was last year.

    I'd be inclined to agree with EGB and others who have suggested good service would get us the goals that would allow us to steamroll teams. Not necessarily a winger but a player who excels at crossing, dead balls and corners would be my shout.
    Keatings ^^^


    Think I might nip over to Gorgie Farm and count some Chickens before they've hatched

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    I really can't understand the clamour for yet another striker to be brought in. We already have the best goalscorer in the league at the club and whilst Jason has been going through a bad spell and has been out of the team for a few weeks now I am willing to bet he will be back soon and scoring goals again. Yes he is weak in some areas of his game but most 21 year old players are. We also have two strikers in James Keatings and Brian Graham who have scored many goals between them in this league for various clubs. Add to that the experience at a high level of Grant Holt and the pace and tenacity of Martin Boyle and we have some very good strikers at this level who have and will continue to score goals for us this season....as long as they are getting chances created for them.

    IMO we simply do not create enough chances from open play either from quality crosses from wide areas or accurate passing from midfield. No striker no matter how good they are is going to score regularly in a team which doesn't create enough opportunities to score. Take Saturday's game against Falkirk...up against 10 men and totally dominant. How many genuine chances did we create ?. I can only think of one off the top of my head and that was missed by Fontaine. The other huge and long running problem we have is the lack of goals from other areas of the team particularly midfield. None of our midfielders want to commit defenders and get into the box. In January, if we have the money, I would like to see a fast wide player brought in and a creative midfielder, and also genuine cover at left-back. I also would like to see a change in playing style which encourages our midfielders to get forward and get goals, and also I want to an improvement in the quality of our play in the last third of the pitch. We have been poor so far this season in that respect. I doubt we will get Liam Henderson back until next summer if at all. He would be a great addition for us going into a new season back in the top flight.
    Last edited by Greenmachine; 17-11-16 at 22:00.
    "I can't stress enough how important it is to be in possession of the football - it is better to be the matador rather than the bull"

    John Hughes

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    Quote Originally Posted by MixuDave View Post
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    Gadgey ������������������������������������������������
    The words 'done deal' spring tae mind ������
    Think you will find what I posted up NL confirmed the next again night on STV.

    Billy posted he had signed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RUFUS View Post
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    Dobbie is on contract till 30/06/2018 will cost
    Didnt think he would cost us too much mate.
    "THE HIBEES FAMILY"

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Family View Post
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    Think you will find what I posted up NL confirmed the next again night on STV.

    Billy posted he had signed
    You posted it was a done deal hah so wheres Hendo? Cause 'done deal' means its signed and he is a Hibs player! So, pish that it was a 'done deal', and ye can try dress it up anyway yet want, gadgey 😉😂😂😂😂😂😂

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    Quote Originally Posted by MixuDave View Post
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    You posted it was a done deal hah so wheres Hendo? Cause 'done deal' means its signed and he is a Hibs player! So, pish that it was a 'done deal', and ye can try dress it up anyway yet want, gadgey ������������������������������������������
    Keep up eh, NL said we approached them for Liam as he was told they didn't want him, They then wanted to only loan him but Liam didn't want that he wanted to come to us on a permanent basis, although they priced him at an amount we couldn't pay. Exactly what I said. But when it first came to light the deal was going through until the Smellies changed it.

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