Likes Likes:  0
Dislikes Dislikes:  0
Results 1 to 11 of 11

Thread: 50p tax rate - well, that worked well didn't it?

  1. #1
    Radge Private Member

    egb_hibs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    From the Capital
    Posts
    35,897
    Post Thanks / Like
    Mentioned
    101 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quoted
    6401 Post(s)
    vCash
    1000
    Rep Power
    2121

    50p tax rate - well, that worked well didn't it?

    Number of people declaring and paying tax on million pound plus salaries dropped by nearly two thirds, with nearly half of them restored after the 45p rate was announced. Allegedly 7 billion lost from tax revenues overall.

    Still, I'm sure it made some people feel better.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/poli...-tax-rate.html

    http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/b...-2012112850946

  2. #2
    Heavenly Radge
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Oxgangs
    Posts
    707
    Post Thanks / Like
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quoted
    301 Post(s)
    vCash
    1000
    Rep Power
    36
    I loved the little secondary clause in this sentence from the Telegraph piece:
    It is believed that rich Britons moved abroad or took steps to avoid paying the new levy by reducing their taxable incomes.

    Which is a nice roundabout way of saying a bunch of fat cats didn't pay all their tax. Hurrah!

  3. #3
    Quite a bit past it radge






    Sir Shrink's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Posts
    23,864
    Post Thanks / Like
    Mentioned
    93 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quoted
    6340 Post(s)
    vCash
    1000
    Rep Power
    2581
    As Leona Helmsley famously said Only the little people pay taxes



    I doubt that very much Leona. It's just us PAYE folk that pay them.
    These bloody leprechauns spend all day and most of the night mending shoes - they must make a bloody fortune. And it'll be cash in hand.
    Cobblers indeed; and everyone knows they have crocks of gold secreted all over the place. Ive yet to hear of them or any other fabled creatures paying their share of the public debt.

    And dont get me started on fairies.

  4. #4
    Radge Private Member

    egb_hibs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    From the Capital
    Posts
    35,897
    Post Thanks / Like
    Mentioned
    101 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quoted
    6401 Post(s)
    vCash
    1000
    Rep Power
    2121
    Quote Originally Posted by Tomsk09 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I loved the little secondary clause in this sentence from the Telegraph piece:
    It is believed that rich Britons moved abroad or took steps to avoid paying the new levy by reducing their taxable incomes.

    Which is a nice roundabout way of saying a bunch of fat cats didn't pay all their tax. Hurrah!
    Indeed, as was predictable. But the 50p zealots went ahead anyway - it was always about spite and populism rather than increasing the tax take.

  5. #5
    Radge Private Member


    tayside hibee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    as far away fi The Saville Dome as possible
    Posts
    2,889
    Post Thanks / Like
    Mentioned
    8 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quoted
    1151 Post(s)
    vCash
    1000
    Rep Power
    406
    Quote Originally Posted by egb_hibs View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Indeed, as was predictable. But the 50p zealots went ahead anyway - it was always about spite and populism rather than increasing the tax take.
    Was it not possible to bring out the law, and implement it?

    What a crazy far out concept that would be

    It ain't just Huns and the mini version that are tax dodging thiefs. It's only us stupid $#@!s that pay the going rate

  6. #6
    Radge Private Member

    egb_hibs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    From the Capital
    Posts
    35,897
    Post Thanks / Like
    Mentioned
    101 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quoted
    6401 Post(s)
    vCash
    1000
    Rep Power
    2121
    Quote Originally Posted by tayside hibee View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Was it not possible to bring out the law, and implement it?

    What a crazy far out concept that would be

    It ain't just Huns and the mini version that are tax dodging thiefs. It's only us stupid $#@!s that pay the going rate
    Not sure what you mean - tax dodgers should be pursued, though as hungunt scenarios demonstrate it's far from easy to do. But this is about the fact that raising tax rates too high results in revenue drops.

  7. #7
    Radge Private Member


    tayside hibee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    as far away fi The Saville Dome as possible
    Posts
    2,889
    Post Thanks / Like
    Mentioned
    8 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quoted
    1151 Post(s)
    vCash
    1000
    Rep Power
    406
    Quote Originally Posted by egb_hibs View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Not sure what you mean - tax dodgers should be pursued, though as hungunt scenarios demonstrate it's far from easy to do. But this is about the fact that raising tax rates too high results in revenue drops.
    Higher taxes might work if they pursued them with the same gusto as they do small businesses, car owners or even someone who has the Fukin audacity to own a tv
    Revenues down because of tax hike $#@! all to do with the recession then . One would expect revenues to soar in such times eh

    Two thirds of the million pound plus team left britain, my $#@!in baws. They put half their cash in their dogs name, paid it in loans, the list is endless and we have to to suck it up, and believe its because someone dared to take a bit extra from greedy.
    While the needy are kept in their place as their benefits and services get cut

    I realise my belief that people should be taxed at source, all under the same rules is simplistic and isn't going to happen. But it shouldnt really be a hard dream to achieve

    "The more we tax rich people , the less they pay" is really a statement that should be investigated

  8. #8
    Radge Donator

    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    Glasgow
    Posts
    1,123
    Post Thanks / Like
    Mentioned
    46 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quoted
    278 Post(s)
    vCash
    1000
    Rep Power
    223
    Quote Originally Posted by tayside hibee View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    "The more we tax rich people , the less they pay" is really a statement that should be investigated
    I agree tayside. I can't think of other areas where the reponse to loopholes that allow people doing everything that they can to avoid the law would be 'lets change the law' rather than close the loopholes. 'They just wont pay it!', well feckin make them pay it!

  9. #9
    Radge Private Member

    egb_hibs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    From the Capital
    Posts
    35,897
    Post Thanks / Like
    Mentioned
    101 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quoted
    6401 Post(s)
    vCash
    1000
    Rep Power
    2121
    Quote Originally Posted by tayside hibee View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Higher taxes might work if they pursued them with the same gusto as they do small businesses, car owners or even someone who has the Fukin audacity to own a tv
    Revenues down because of tax hike $#@! all to do with the recession then . One would expect revenues to soar in such times eh

    Two thirds of the million pound plus team left britain, my $#@!in baws. They put half their cash in their dogs name, paid it in loans, the list is endless and we have to to suck it up, and believe its because someone dared to take a bit extra from greedy.
    While the needy are kept in their place as their benefits and services get cut

    I realise my belief that people should be taxed at source, all under the same rules is simplistic and isn't going to happen. But it shouldnt really be a hard dream to achieve

    "The more we tax rich people , the less they pay" is really a statement that should be investigated
    I agree with you that the assumption they left is a big assumption, hence my comment on the article simply says that the amount paying went down.

    We could go on about the factors that drive the endless demand for tax revenues, which are a little more complex than your description, and which make it all rather less morally clear. But that's another subject.

    The bottom line here is that we can bellyache about what ought to be the case, but those more concerned with what is the case said that this would cost us revenues we can ill afford to lose, and so it has. Rationality loses to emotionalism and ideology once again.

  10. #10
    Heavenly Radge
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Oxgangs
    Posts
    707
    Post Thanks / Like
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quoted
    301 Post(s)
    vCash
    1000
    Rep Power
    36
    Quote Originally Posted by egb_hibs View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I agree with you that the assumption they left is a big assumption, hence my comment on the article simply says that the amount paying went down.

    We could go on about the factors that drive the endless demand for tax revenues, which are a little more complex than your description, and which make it all rather less morally clear. But that's another subject.

    The bottom line here is that we can bellyache about what ought to be the case, but those more concerned with what is the case said that this would cost us revenues we can ill afford to lose, and so it has. Rationality loses to emotionalism and ideology once again.

    There are (at least) two ways to respond to this story. (With all due respect, your response is a bit eccentric.)

    You could adopt the position shared by the Telegraph and the Chancellor of the Exchequer that raising taxes on the super-rich is counterproductive and only ends in lower revenues and, therefore, we shouldn't do it. (And, of course, it's all the fault of the last Labour government.)

    Or, you could conclude that it is at least morally questionable those citizens of this country are actively avoiding tax, some even to the extent of domiciling abroad, and that the government should be actively closing opportunities for that tax avoidance.

    I think to adopt the first position you would have to have lived a very privileged, even cosseted existence with absolutely no exposure to how 99% of your fellow citizens actually live.

    The story has been spun by the Telegraph, with a handy quote from the Chancellor of the Exchequer, to imply that the loss of revenues is due to fat cats fleeing the country. There is no real evidence for that. For all we know the loss revenue is due to clever accounting, EBTs and the likes. And it may even be a consequence of the wider recession. In fact, it occurs to me that the tax avoiders may not have had to do anything at all but just continued on their merry way -- after all, if you're dodging tax before a rate increase you are hardly like to start paying the full whack after the rate goes up.

    The voice of privilege, as represented by the Telegraph and Gideon Osbourne, speaks. Its target is not the tax avoiders but the last government. The lack of self-awareness is staggering.

    Incidentally, has the treasury calculated the loss of revenues under both the Tory and Labour models. I wonder if the totals would be significantly different? My money would be on the Labour model raising more revenue.

  11. #11
    Radge Private Member

    egb_hibs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    From the Capital
    Posts
    35,897
    Post Thanks / Like
    Mentioned
    101 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quoted
    6401 Post(s)
    vCash
    1000
    Rep Power
    2121
    Tomsk, my own comment removed the telegraphs assumptions which I agree are big ones. I simply noted that (by whatever means) two thirds of formerly declared millionaires had disappeared with a commensurate dip in revenues.

    I find your view that my comments were eccentric to be remarkable, and illustrative of how distant from reality ideology can take people.

    To say that it was predictable that revenues would drop and they have is - given that I along with countless others made that prediction - a simple statement of fact. Your views on what should happen are fair enough, but sort of beside the point. No such means to ensure payment existed or exists ergo the 50p tax rate predictably has had the effect it has had.

    If you want eccentric, then believing things would be otherwise without such means being put in place first, strikes me as just that. And to recklessly pursue a policy that will reduce revenues when we sorely need them, in order to satisfy an emotional response; that too strikes me as eccentric.

GoGO Back To Forum

Similar Threads

  1. The Escapades - Please rate
    By dangerousdavid in forum The Pie Stand
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 29-09-08, 11:02
  2. Rate The Avatar...
    By Uncle Jager in forum The Pie Stand
    Replies: 79
    Last Post: 02-07-08, 14:14
  3. Rate my vid!!!
    By ECKtheHIBEE in forum Frenchman's Cowshed
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 12-06-07, 18:57

User Tag List

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •