Don't blame the player's

[timberfox]

As a Hibs supporter now for 30+ years, like many others i have seen good days and bad days at ER and the last season also had it's ups and downs, I have cheered and jeered like many others in The East and i feel it's our right to show passion for the team we support and for the last year as a junior bounce member i read with sometimes amusement and sometimes anger at some of the posts about the player's and the managements lack of funding but have not until today felt the need to post my thoughts , I apologize but bear with me please. In any workplace if you have a colleague thats works in a junior position to you then it is always deemed that you show this junior how things are done and how to be the best at what they do so they too can have a feeling of worthiness and pride in the workplace.. Football is no different and rather than blame the players and controversially i will say" We have some of the best players outside the OF" , These players were signed after being watched with their respective clubs and showed promise and the flair that ER needed . So what happened ??? The main thing, management, and thats where i think the blame lies.
After watching our performance at ER against Elfsborg and again yesterday i was shocked by the way our players are being taught tactics and discipline on the field .. A few examples : how many times at ER have you wondered why the whole team is playing within ten yards of the West stand (scrapping i would call it) which ends in balls being kicked wildly in any direction and invariably end at the oppositions feet as we have no players anywhere else on field, yes and i bet you too see it and are infuriated ( positional discipline ) and when the opposition get the ball and start for our goals from halfway in their half ??? yes we run with them ??? not at them!! too put them under pressure and make a bad pass, we track them all the way back too our goals then we have 8 players within feet of the opposition with the ball and half an empty field which they have men wide in easy pass out to the wing and we are wide open again , This is where our stamina fails us again, it's not that our guys are not fit its just they end up running all over the place, Again discipline ,hold your position so the defense have more than two feet to clear the ball to another player and and out of trouble, if discipline is in place with the position of midfield and forwards = less running and smoother passing and more chance of getting up to their goal area, but what invariably happens is we have 8 + players panicking too clear the ball and blocking the keepers view , they take a lucky hoof and because the ball is blocked by so many players the keeper has little or no chance too respond and we blame the keeper. Discipline is put in place by Management and the coaching staff and i am afraid it's well below par . The players we have are good ,very good in fact, what fails the players is the teachers of discipline on the field and as i say thats the Management and the coaching staff.
I'm sorry for the rant but i would like fellow bouncer's thought's also and criticism of the above if any lol as the staff are only as good as the teachers.

G.G.T.T.H.

[The Family]

Originally Posted by timberfox
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As a Hibs supporter now for 30+ years, like many others i have seen good days and bad days at ER and the last season also had it's ups and downs, I have cheered and jeered like many others in The East and i feel it's our right to show passion for the team we support and for the last year as a junior bounce member i read with sometimes amusement and sometimes anger at some of the posts about the player's and the managements lack of funding but have not until today felt the need to post my thoughts , I apologize but bear with me please. In any workplace if you have a colleague thats works in a junior position to you then it is always deemed that you show this junior how things are done and how to be the best at what they do so they too can have a feeling of worthiness and pride in the workplace.. Football is no different and rather than blame the players and controversially i will say" We have some of the best players outside the OF" , These players were signed after being watched with their respective clubs and showed promise and the flair that ER needed . So what happened ??? The main thing, management, and thats where i think the blame lies.
After watching our performance at ER against Elfsborg and again yesterday i was shocked by the way our players are being taught tactics and discipline on the field .. A few examples : how many times at ER have you wondered why the whole team is playing within ten yards of the West stand (scrapping i would call it) which ends in balls being kicked wildly in any direction and invariably end at the oppositions feet as we have no players anywhere else on field, yes and i bet you too see it and are infuriated ( positional discipline ) and when the opposition get the ball and start for our goals from halfway in their half ??? yes we run with them ??? not at them!! too put them under pressure and make a bad pass, we track them all the way back too our goals then we have 8 players within feet of the opposition with the ball and half an empty field which they have men wide in easy pass out to the wing and we are wide open again , This is where our stamina fails us again, it's not that our guys are not fit its just they end up running all over the place, Again discipline ,hold your position so the defense have more than two feet to clear the ball to another player and and out of trouble, if discipline is in place with the position of midfield and forwards = less running and smoother passing and more chance of getting up to their goal area, but what invariably happens is we have 8 + players panicking too clear the ball and blocking the keepers view , they take a lucky hoof and because the ball is blocked by so many players the keeper has little or no chance too respond and we blame the keeper. Discipline is put in place by Management and the coaching staff and i am afraid it's well below par . The players we have are good ,very good in fact, what fails the players is the teachers of discipline on the field and as i say thats the Management and the coaching staff.
I'm sorry for the rant but i would like fellow bouncer's thought's also and criticism of the above if any lol as the staff are only as good as the teachers.

G.G.T.T.H.

Mate, i totally agree with you the way we are playing at the moment is shocking one up front at home is total embarrassing, what happened to the free flow passing game Hibs used to play we totally ripped teams playing the ball on the deck, with Nish in the team its always going to be the long ball game, as i have said on a numerous amount of times on here Nish is gash and should be punted along with the other dross even the Killie fans that seen him week in and week out weren't to bothered about him leaving, time to change our tactics or Mixu will fail big time.

[bigmanandy]

Originally Posted by timberfox
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As a Hibs supporter now for 30+ years, like many others i have seen good days and bad days at ER and the last season also had it's ups and downs, I have cheered and jeered like many others in The East and i feel it's our right to show passion for the team we support and for the last year as a junior bounce member i read with sometimes amusement and sometimes anger at some of the posts about the player's and the managements lack of funding but have not until today felt the need to post my thoughts , I apologize but bear with me please. In any workplace if you have a colleague thats works in a junior position to you then it is always deemed that you show this junior how things are done and how to be the best at what they do so they too can have a feeling of worthiness and pride in the workplace.. Football is no different and rather than blame the players and controversially i will say" We have some of the best players outside the OF" , These players were signed after being watched with their respective clubs and showed promise and the flair that ER needed . So what happened ??? The main thing, management, and thats where i think the blame lies.
After watching our performance at ER against Elfsborg and again yesterday i was shocked by the way our players are being taught tactics and discipline on the field .. A few examples : how many times at ER have you wondered why the whole team is playing within ten yards of the West stand (scrapping i would call it) which ends in balls being kicked wildly in any direction and invariably end at the oppositions feet as we have no players anywhere else on field, yes and i bet you too see it and are infuriated ( positional discipline ) and when the opposition get the ball and start for our goals from halfway in their half ??? yes we run with them ??? not at them!! too put them under pressure and make a bad pass, we track them all the way back too our goals then we have 8 players within feet of the opposition with the ball and half an empty field which they have men wide in easy pass out to the wing and we are wide open again , This is where our stamina fails us again, it's not that our guys are not fit its just they end up running all over the place, Again discipline ,hold your position so the defense have more than two feet to clear the ball to another player and and out of trouble, if discipline is in place with the position of midfield and forwards = less running and smoother passing and more chance of getting up to their goal area, but what invariably happens is we have 8 + players panicking too clear the ball and blocking the keepers view , they take a lucky hoof and because the ball is blocked by so many players the keeper has little or no chance too respond and we blame the keeper. Discipline is put in place by Management and the coaching staff and i am afraid it's well below par . The players we have are good ,very good in fact, what fails the players is the teachers of discipline on the field and as i say thats the Management and the coaching staff.
I'm sorry for the rant but i would like fellow bouncer's thought's also and criticism of the above if any lol as the staff are only as good as the teachers.

G.G.T.T.H.

Dissagree...

We've got players like Kerr and O'Brien in our team who frankly are not good enough...

We used to have the best players outside the OF in Katy Thomson, Scott Brown, Riordan, O'Conner....the list goes on...now we seem to be going downhill and desperatly need some investment in the team or else this could turn out to be a very poor next season for us...

We need signings or younger players to come into the team and show what talent they have and make us a better team, but at this moment there has not been alot of younger players given a chance and Mixu has even got rid of some of our better younger talent, we need a experienced player to come in and take Boozys place someone who can run the Midfeild..

There is some things wrong with the management and one of the things i think is that Mixu does not have alot of contacts within the game meaning in a lack of signings, the board have not helped and have never helped and this is a reason we have lost managers in the past because the funds are just not given out at our club to sign new players while at other clubs who are in alot more debt than us still manage to sign quality players its just not good enough for a team like ours.
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[The Family]

Originally Posted by bigmanandy
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Dissagree...

We've got players like Kerr and O'Brien in our team who frankly are not good enough...

We used to have the best players outside the OF in Katy Thomson, Scott Brown, Riordan, O'Conner....the list goes on...now we seem to be going downhill and desperatly need some investment in the team or else this could turn out to be a very poor next season for us...

We need signings or younger players to come into the team and show what talent they have and make us a better team, but at this moment there has not been alot of younger players given a chance and Mixu has even got rid of some of our better younger talent, we need a experienced player to come in and take Boozys place someone who can run the Midfeild..

There is some things wrong with the management and one of the things i think is that Mixu does not have alot of contacts within the game meaning in a lack of signings, the board have not helped and have never helped and this is a reason we have lost managers in the past because the funds are just not given out at our club to sign new players while at other clubs who are in alot more debt than us still manage to sign quality players its just not good enough for a team like ours.
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Totally buddy we need a big clear out but i fear what players will come in on the budget we work with and the lack of contacts Mixu has in the game along with his tactics.

[timberfox]

Dissagree...

We've got players like Kerr and O'Brien in our team who frankly are not good enough...

We used to have the best players outside the OF in Katy Thomson, Scott Brown, Riordan, O'Conner....the list goes on...now we seem to be going downhill and desperatly need some investment in the team or else this could turn out to be a very poor next season for us...

We need signings or younger players to come into the team and show what talent they have and make us a better team, but at this moment there has not been alot of younger players given a chance and Mixu has even got rid of some of our better younger talent, we need a experienced player to come in and take Boozys place someone who can run the Midfeild..

There is some things wrong with the management and one of the things i think is that Mixu does not have alot of contacts within the game meaning in a lack of signings, the board have not helped and have never helped and this is a reason we have lost managers in the past because the funds are just not given out at our club to sign new players while at other clubs who are in alot more debt than us still manage to sign quality players its just not good enough for a team like ours.
__________________
Good points , But whoever gets brought in end up with the same management tactics as our current players have and it's not working for them so why will it work with new players??? Lets teach the current players proper football and we are half way there , do you not think

[GalegoHibs]

Leaving the Elfsborg fiasco aside for the moment... I think some have already forgotten that, despite a poor end to the season, our league position still improved under Mixu. Therefore, I think the talk of poor organisation is unjustified in the main.

Another matter causing a lot of concern is clearly the style of play. That is a different issue from poor organisation though. It's simply that the type of tactics being used are not the ones the majority of fans like to see. In my opinion, there would be far fewer complaints about that if Hibs were winning most of their games.

Many seem to think Dundee United have better players and management than us but we matched them last season.

McGhee and Motherwell obviously did a lot better. He was the manager last season who did the best job of making a silk purse out of a sow's ear. (It will be interesting to see if he can repeat the feat.)

So Mixu hasn't been the best manager in the league so far but he hasn't been that bad.

The main difference is that when you take into account average gates and the fact that in recent seasons Hibs have taken in far more in transfer fees than most of the SPL put together, the Well and DU owners have given their manager more significant backing on the park.

It's no easy tae mak a silk purse oot o a sou's lug.

[bigmanandy]

Originally Posted by timberfox
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__________________
Good points , But whoever gets brought in end up with the same management tactics as our current players have and it's not working for them so why will it work with new players??? Lets teach the current players proper football and we are half way there , do you not think

Yeah i agree with that but Mixu seems to prefer his defensive style tactics which bore everyone and with the one striker up front subject again it just doesn't work at our club this is the reason at the moment that a majority of ST holders havn't renewed there ST's as we want to see flair and that was the main reason we got fans coming back to the games in the first place because we had 'Flair'.

[mikeythibs]

Originally Posted by bigmanandy
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Yeah i agree with that but Mixu seems to prefer his defensive style tactics which bore everyone

That right?


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and with the one striker up front subject again it just doesn't work at our club this is the reason at the moment that a majority of ST holders havn't renewed there ST's as we want to see flair and that was the main reason we got fans coming back to the games in the first place because we had 'Flair'.

You're going to have to back that one up. How do you know?

[Timoumi]

All of the players are considered PROFESSOINALS!!

Professionals aren't supposed to play, the way hibs have been playing lately.

[mikeythibs]

a bounce poll here says yer haverin Mandy...
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[bigmanandy]

Originally Posted by mikeythibs
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That right?


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You're going to have to back that one up. How do you know?

Until they see improvements at Hibs...The only reason fans started buying season tickets again is because we had Flair and where a attacking minded team but thats changed now we have gone defensive and its not very exciting for people to watch...

Theres been threads about it aswell over on that other site aswell some of the fans who have not renewed have been ST holders for longer than i have lived so it does tell you something.

[mikeythibs]

Originally Posted by bigmanandy
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Until they see improvements at Hibs...The only reason fans started buying season tickets again is because we had Flair and where a attacking minded team but thats changed now we have gone defensive and its not very exciting for people to watch...

Theres been threads about it aswell over on that other site aswell some of the fans who have not renewed have been ST holders for longer than i have lived so it does tell you something.

Yer still haverin, these are your assumptions. You have no hard facts to back them up. You dont know how many people have renewed but I bet you it is not a majority who have not renewed.

I also reckon that if some people have not renewed there will be a number of factors involved including money flow - this so called credit crunch will affect some folks, no doubt.

as for Hibs fans buying season tickets it is something that is a very odd thing historically. You are over simplifying things. When we had the TTs or the FF we hardly had ANY season ticket holders. Plenty flair then. The move towards more ST holders has been a cultural thing in the spl as a whole, packages for bairns and payment packages allowing people to pay in installments. So many reasons.

If we sell fewer I doubt we will be that much out of line with everyone else - the spl was on an attendance downturn last season across the board.

[GalegoHibs]

Originally Posted by mikeythibs
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a bounce poll here says yer haverin Mandy...
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Think Manders has got a point actually.
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Maybe not a majority, but according to that poll almost 30% have not yet renewed their season tickets and there are less than 2% of first time holders. Based on that, season ticket sales could drop significantly and it's probably got a lot to do with lack of flair combined with (at best) average results.

[bigmanandy]

Originally Posted by GalegoHibs
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Think Manders has got a point actually.
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Maybe not a majority, but according to that poll almost 30% have not yet renewed their season tickets and there are less than 2% of first time holders. Based on that, season ticket sales could drop significantly and it's probably got a lot to do with lack of flair combined with (at best) average results.

I new i seen it somewhere
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Its a bit dissapointing if it ends up that way, fans should follow there club through the good and the bad at the end of the day and that poll with the numbers that havn't renewed just makes you wonder.

[Forzahibs]

Originally Posted by mikeythibs
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Yer still haverin, these are your assumptions. You have no hard facts to back them up. You dont know how many people have renewed but I bet you it is not a majority who have not renewed.

I also reckon that if some people have not renewed there will be a number of factors involved including money flow - this so called credit crunch will affect some folks, no doubt.

as for Hibs fans buying season tickets it is something that is a very odd thing historically. You are over simplifying things. When we had the TTs or the FF we hardly had ANY season ticket holders. Plenty flair then. The move towards more ST holders has been a cultural thing in the spl as a whole, packages for bairns and payment packages allowing people to pay in installments. So many reasons.

If we sell fewer I doubt we will be that much out of line with everyone else - the spl was on an attendance downturn last season across the board.

If BMA means that the majority of those who haven't renewed haven't done so because of pish fitba and too little investment i reckon he's 100% right

[bigmanandy]

Originally Posted by Forzahibs
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If BMA means that the majority of those who haven't renewed haven't done so because of pish fitba and too little investment i reckon he's 100% right

Aye thats what i mean its sad but true, if Hibs dont buck up there idea's, get some players in, start playing and stop coming out in the papers saying stupid things then the attendances are going to drop.

[mikeythibs]

Originally Posted by bigmanandy
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Aye thats what i mean

Well thats not what you wrote
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[Forzahibs]

Originally Posted by bigmanandy
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Aye thats what i mean its sad but true, if Hibs dont buck up there idea's, get some players in, start playing and stop coming out in the papers saying stupid things then the attendances are going to drop.

I totally agree

[geegee1978]

Originally Posted by The Family
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Mate, i totally agree with you the way we are playing at the moment is shocking one up front at home is total embarrassing, what happened t