The injuries excuse

[Greenmachine]

Maybe it's just me, but I cannot for the life of me understand why Tony Mowbray, the media, and certain Hibs fans are blaming yesterdays 4-0 mauling on having too many injuries. I am not disputing for one minute that the manager was left with very few options, but he along with a lot of pundits are putting our embarrassing defeat down to that reason alone. Not so IMO. Let's examine the crucial moments of the game:

In the first half possession was about even, with Hearts looking more "up for it" in general, and playing with more purpose. However, IMO they did not seriously threaten a goal until we made a blunder in the midfield, and once again we were caught on the break. We were then left with 4 on 3 and a goal was inevitable. Before this however, we had missed three decent set-piece headers, so probably should have got the first goal. With a bit of luck we would have went in level at half-time.

In the second half, without having to create anything, Hearts are gifted three goals by the goalkeeper. Bingo 4-0. Nothing to do with injuries and key players out, everything to do with poor team selection (goalkeeper in particular), bad tactics, indiscipline, and basic errors.

Hibs did not look ready for the game, They were second to just about every ball, and Hearts seemed to want it more. Who is reponsible for that ? The players, yes,but also the manager. However when you look at the game it was basic errors, the same ones we have been seeing all season, and bad preparation which really cost us.

[Smurf]

Originally Posted by Greenmachine

Maybe it's just me, but I cannot for the life of me understand why Tony Mowbray, the media, and certain Hibs fans are blaming yesterdays 4-0 mauling on having too many injuries. I am not disputing for one minute that the manager was left with very few options, but he along with a lot of pundits are putting our embarrassing defeat down to that reason alone. Not so IMO. Let's examine the crucial moments of the game:

In the first half possession was about even, with Hearts looking more "up for it" in general, and playing with more purpose. However, IMO they did not seriously threaten a goal until we made a blunder in the midfield, and once again we were caught on the break. We were then left with 4 on 3 and a goal was inevitable. Before this however, we had missed three decent set-piece headers, so probably should have got the first goal. With a bit of luck we would have went in level at half-time.

In the second half, without having to create anything, Hearts are gifted three goals by the goalkeeper. Bingo 4-0. Nothing to do with injuries and key players out, everything to do with poor team selection (goalkeeper in particular), bad tactics, indisciplie, and basic errors.

Hibs did not look ready for the game, They were second to just about every ball, and Hearts seemed to want it more. Who is reponsible for that ? The players, yes,but also the manager. However when you look at the game it was basic errors, the same ones we have been seeing all season, and bad preparation which really cost us.

Tony Mowbray is still in credit with the support but IMO he's beginning to run out a little. From now until the end of the season is crucial. We simply must finish 4th.

[Proclaimers]

Originally Posted by Greenmachine

Maybe it's just me, but I cannot for the life of me understand why Tony Mowbray, the media, and certain Hibs fans are blaming yesterdays 4-0 mauling on having too many injuries. I am not disputing for one minute that the manager was left with very few options, but he along with a lot of pundits are putting our embarrassing defeat down to that reason alone. Not so IMO. Let's examine the crucial moments of the game:

In the first half possession was about even, with Hearts looking more "up for it" in general, and playing with more purpose. However, IMO they did not seriously threaten a goal until we made a blunder in the midfield, and once again we were caught on the break. We were then left with 4 on 3 and a goal was inevitable. Before this however, we had missed three decent set-piece headers, so probably should have got the first goal. With a bit of luck we would have went in level at half-time.

In the second half, without having to create anything, Hearts are gifted three goals by the goalkeeper. Bingo 4-0. Nothing to do with injuries and key players out, everything to do with poor team selection (goalkeeper in particular), bad tactics, indisciplie, and basic errors.

Hibs did not look ready for the game, They were second to just about every ball, and Hearts seemed to want it more. Who is reponsible for that ? The players, yes,but also the manager. However when you look at the game it was basic errors, the same ones we have been seeing all season, and bad preparation which really cost us.

I totally agree. I know we had a lot of injuries that did not help but the team out there was capable of pulling off a victory if each of them had put in 100% and kept the ball on the ground.

I would not have minded if we had lost 4-0 with four great goals scored by the Gunts but we gifted them each one which annoys me.

Apart from the 2-0 game at ER, Hearts have looked much more up for the derby games especially yesterday's game, and I want to know why that is. Is it the players who just don't care as much as the gunts or,dare I say it, is it Tony who isn't getting the players fired up?

[CadgeMac]

very good post, im not blaming the defeat on injuries but surely with a fully fit team we would have stood a better chance of beating them especially when they had basically a full strength team.

killen would have given the defence all sorts of problems
deek would have done better with the set pieces and he always seems to score screamers against hearts.
then mikey,scotty and boozy 3 of our best midfielders aswell as deano and antonio murray.

[GloryGlory]

You cant expect to beat Hearts with key players like Killen Brown Boozy Riordan and Stewart missing. And they are key players and all would have been playing. That said the players on the pitch are of a decent enough standard to have got a result and were shocking. Dont know if they were told to play long ball but 7 times out of 10 they chose to anyway.

[blue toon hibby]

Originally Posted by CadgeMac

very good post, im not blaming the defeat on injuries but surely with atleast 3 or 4 of the key players that were out in the team yesterday we could have done it.

killen would have given the defence all sorts of problems
deek would have done better with the set pieces and he always seems to score screamers against hearts.
then mikey,scotty and boozy almot a whole midfield aswell as deano and antonio murray.

Agreed - Killen could have done damage yesterday. Ivan might be the second coming in many people's eyes but he needs the ball at his feet, not punted high and handsome. Benji too, looks like he could get in about them with more match practice and the right kind of service.

[DOWN SOUTH]

When I was told on the radio Sunday morning we had four players out and just who they were my heart(sorry) sank.
We just do not have the squad or depth.
Had we been with those players sure the game would have been alot closer.
[i]My heart was broken,
sorrow,sorow.
DAVE ROBERTS,
SOUTHAMPTON

[HIBEESLIM]

Originally Posted by Greenmachine

Maybe it's just me, but I cannot for the life of me understand why Tony Mowbray, the media, and certain Hibs fans are blaming yesterdays 4-0 mauling on having too many injuries. I am not disputing for one minute that the manager was left with very few options, but he along with a lot of pundits are putting our embarrassing defeat down to that reason alone. Not so IMO. Let's examine the crucial moments of the game:

In the first half possession was about even, with Hearts looking more "up for it" in general, and playing with more purpose. However, IMO they did not seriously threaten a goal until we made a blunder in the midfield, and once again we were caught on the break. We were then left with 4 on 3 and a goal was inevitable. Before this however, we had missed three decent set-piece headers, so probably should have got the first goal. With a bit of luck we would have went in level at half-time.

In the second half, without having to create anything, Hearts are gifted three goals by the goalkeeper. Bingo 4-0. Nothing to do with injuries and key players out, everything to do with poor team selection (goalkeeper in particular), bad tactics, indisciplie, and basic errors.

Hibs did not look ready for the game, They were second to just about every ball, and Hearts seemed to want it more. Who is reponsible for that ? The players, yes,but also the manager. However when you look at the game it was basic errors, the same ones we have been seeing all season, and bad preparation which really cost us.

5 things IMO were wrong on sunday
1/the depth of our squad or lack of depth was all there to see.a few injurys along with suspentions=the bare bones
2/caldwell should have been in midfield not whittaker.both i thought were lost in these positions
3/glass i hope went home and had a good look at himself in the mirror.when we needed a bit of bite in the middle of the park he was powderpuff
4/2 wee guys up front....we are a great passing team....WHY THE LONG BALLS THEN???????
5/ZIBBI

[SkyeHibs]

Originally Posted by blue toon hibby

Ivan might be the second coming in many people's eyes but he needs the ball at his feet, not punted high and handsome.

Which begs the question why the high and handsome approach which was meat and drink to the Yams defence.

[HIBEESLIM]

dont get me wrong up to the point zibbi lost the plot and started to gift the yams the goals i thought we hade a good chance at pegging the yams back to 1-1.

[Smurf]

Originally Posted by LanarkHibs

Which begs the question why the high and handsome approach which was meat and drink to the Yams defence.

Particularly when Tony said in yesterday's press..

"My players will know the things i dislike," said Mowbray. "For instance, i don't want them to aimlessly hook the ball over their shoulder up the field or aimlessly throw the ball down the line from throw-ins."

[The__Proclaimer]

Originally Posted by Greenmachine

Maybe it's just me, but I cannot for the life of me understand why Tony Mowbray, the media, and certain Hibs fans are blaming yesterdays 4-0 mauling on having too many injuries.

It wasn't Tony Mowbray who had 4 great opportunites in the first half to hit the target but struck each miles over the bar. It wasn't Tony Mowbray who was assinged the right back position but drifted into centre defence at every opportunity ultimately gifting the first goal. It wasn't Tony Mowbray who let his frustrations get the better of him, miss-positioned himself at free-kicks or was anonymous in midfield.

Our strikers had a combined age of under 40 and one of them has never even played a minute of reserve team football. The goals were never going to fly in but if Whitty had more composure and basic errors weren't made we could have been 2 or 3 up at half-time and cruising. That's football.

[Greenmachine]

Originally Posted by The__Proclaimer

It wasn't Tony Mowbray who had 4 great opportunites in the first half to hit the target but struck each miles over the bar. It wasn't Tony Mowbray who was assinged the right back position but drifted into centre defence at every opportunity ultimately gifting the first goal. It wasn't Tony Mowbray who let his frustrations get the better of him, miss-positioned himself at free-kicks or was anonymous in midfield.

Our strikers had a combined age of under 40 and one of them has never even played a minute of reserve team football. The goals were never going to fly in but if Whitty had more composure and basic errors weren't made we could have been 2 or 3 up at half-time and cruising. That's football.

Completely missing the point of my post. The 4-0 gubbing has been blamed almost entirely on a lack of players available. With the possible exception of the first goal (which also came about through a basic error), the other goals were gifted to Hearts on a plate by the goalkeeper not doing the basics of his job properly. How does having lots of injuries result in that happening ?. It was basic errors by well-paid professionals which cost us the game, and at least David Murphy has had the guts to come out and say it publicly.

[HibeeSned]

Have to be honest, I'm not sure I like Tony Mowbray much. He has the motivational skills of a snail and seems incapable of psyching up the team. Just listen to his pre and post match comments, no determination and no fight.

Not saying he's a bad manager, but Hibs just don't seem motivated under him.

Yesterday's performance was just plain lazy, Hibs looking like they just couldn't be bothered.

We WERE capable of winning yesterday.

[500miles]

Originally Posted by HibeeSned

Have to be honest, I'm not sure I like Tony Mowbray much. He has the motivational skills of a snail and seems incapable of psyching up the team. Just listen to his pre and post match comments, no determination and no fight.

Not saying he's a bad manager, but Hibs just don't seem motivated under him.

Yesterday's performance was just plain lazy, Hibs looking like they just couldn't be bothered.

We WERE capable of winning yesterday.

Totally disagree mate, we had no chance with all those people missing. It wasnt as if it was one or two from each area, we were missing our entire midfield apart from thomson, not a good thing if you want to play passing football. We were almost forced into the long ball, and we had no success with that because of the lack of height.

[Greenmachine]

Originally Posted by HibeeSned

Have to be honest, I'm not sure I like Tony Mowbray much. He has the motivational skills of a snail and seems incapable of psyching up the team. Just listen to his pre and post match comments, no determination and no fight.

Not saying he's a bad manager, but Hibs just don't seem motivated under him.

Yesterday's performance was just plain lazy, Hibs looking like they just couldn't be bothered.

We WERE capable of winning yesterday.

Every manager has his own style, and his own way of motivating players. Arsene Wenger and Allan Curbishley don't seem the obvious motivating types but they always get the best out of their teams. I just think that the injuries problem (bad though it was) is being used as a bit of a red herring. The goals were lost through a recurrence of basic defensive errors and very poor concentration by the goalkeeper.

[GloryGlory]

Originally Posted by 500miles

We were almost forced into the long ball, and we had no success with that because of the lack of height.

Aye because Thomson Glass Whittaker Fletcher Sproule Murphy are all terrible at passing a ball on the ground

[Pilrig]

Even with a full strength outfield team, they'd still be toiling to make up ground after the gross goalkeeping errors we saw yesterday.

[The__Proclaimer]

Originally Posted by Greenmachine

Completely missing the point of my post. The 4-0 gubbing has been blamed almost entirely on a lack of players available. With the possible exception of the first goal (which also came about through a basic error), the other goals were gifted to Hearts on a plate by the goalkeeper not doing the basics of his job properly. How does having lots of injuries result in that happening ?. It was basic errors by well-paid professionals which cost us the game, and at least David Murphy has had the guts to come out and say it publicly.

I'm trying to back you up. We were down to the bare skeleton of our squad and we could have still beat a Hearts team second in the league and with a squad boosted by 11 new players in January.

Rumours of Tony Mowbray's demise are premature.

[Dr Shrink]

Originally Posted by Greenmachine

Completely missing the point of my post. The 4-0 gubbing has been blamed almost entirely on a lack of players available. With the possible exception of the first goal (which also came about through a basic error), the other goals were gifted to Hearts on a plate by the goalkeeper not doing the basics of his job properly. How does having lots of injuries result in that happening ?. It was basic errors by well-paid professionals which cost us the game, and at least David Murphy has had the guts to come out and say it publicly.

I'm not sure if it missed the point of your post Greenman, it just added to it. The injuries deprived us of a settled team formation, but some of those who played just failed to play at a decent level.
For what it's worth I think Proc has made valid points, although your basic premise that the goalkeeper threw the game with his comedy goalkeeping is undeniable.
My head went down a bit when I saw the team selection, and that was before I anticipated the goalkeeping blunders.
I read Murph's remarks and he didn't miss anybody.
Rightly so.

[Greenmachine]

Originally Posted by The__Proclaimer

I'm trying to back you up. We were down to the bare skeleton of our squad and we could have still beat a Hearts team second in the league and with a squad boosted by 11 new players in January.

Rumours of Tony Mowbray's demise are premature.

Sorry mate, I misunderstood you. I go along with what you say there.

Also agree that Mowbray will be at ER a long time, and I am still confident he can get us success eventually.

[GloryGlory]

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Greenmachine

Also agree that Mowbray will be at ER a long time, and I am still confident he can get us success eventually.