'The evil legacy of the easter rising'

[egb_hibs]

Hard to believe that this ignorant, poisonous bullshit is from the guardian.

The evil legacy of the Easter Rising

For Ireland to celebrate the 80th anniversary of the 1916 rebellion is to betray democracy

Geoffrey Wheatcroft
Sunday April 9, 2006
The Observer

Last Tuesday, Denis Donaldson was found savagely murdered in County Donegal. Next weekend, the government of the Irish Republic will noisily celebrate the 90th anniversary of the Easter Rising. Perhaps only in Ireland could anyone fail to see the connection between the two.

Although it claimed to be a national rebellion, the rising was a very strange affair. The Irish Republican Brotherhood was a tiny sect with little popular following. In 1914, there had been deep sympathy in Ireland for Belgium as a small Catholic nation brutally violated, the official Nationalist party had supported the Great War and for every 'volunteer' who took part in the rising, there were 100 Irishmen fighting on the Western Front for home rule, which had already been granted by the London government.

As it turned out, the rebels lost their battle but won the 'narrative', to use an irritating but valid term. Sentiment was revolutionised by the executions which followed the rising, Sinn Fein swamped the constitutional party (just as it has recently done in Ulster), a free state was created in 1922 and it soon became what one Tory politician predicted at the time, the most reactionary corner of Europe.

Nor should that have been surprising. Although revisionist Irish historians have spent the past generation examining the creation of the state and its underlying myths, even the best of them tend towards insularity and have not noticed how Ireland fitted into a European pattern.

In the early decades of the 20th century, there was everywhere a reaction against constitutional liberalism into irrationalism, whether it was Mussolini's successful 'march on Rome' in 1922 or Hitler's unsuccessful Munich putsch of 1923.

The Easter Rising was the forerunner, echoed all too often thereafter. Patrick Pearse's exalted (or insane) words about the tired old earth that needed to be enriched by the spilling of much blood - that at a time when the blood of several million young men was being spilled on the Western Front - was the very language of Blut und Boden (blood and soil) that the National Socialists would soon use.

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If the Irish want to celebrate the Easter Rising they may, but they must realise that they are in no moral position whatever to condemn any other violent insurrection against another lawful government carried out by people who feel strongly enough. Looking around the world today, the Easter rebels have a good deal to answer for."

Lawful feckin government
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[egb_hibs]

oooh am fuming, I cannae hardly wait for a reply before ripping this article on so many fronts
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[Purple & Green]

4 words sum up that piece.

"A truly vile article"

[PaddyBarry]

Who is Geoffrey Wheatcroft?

[Northern Ireland Hibby]

Originally Posted by PaddyBarry

Who is Geoffrey Wheatcroft?

A poisonous, embittered wee man by the sound of things.

[hughieo]

Read the "Comments " at the end of the article to cheer yourselves up;
see "comments by "ellis " and Highland paddy"

What a fine morning!

[Pilrig]

Originally Posted by PaddyBarry

Who is Geoffrey Wheatcroft?

The illegitimate son of the Rev. Dr Ian Paisley.

[Smurf]

Originally Posted by PaddyBarry

Who is Geoffrey Wheatcroft?

The name says everything
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[Northern Ireland Hibby]

Originally Posted by PaddyBarry

Who is Geoffrey Wheatcroft?

Google says [Only Registered Users Can See Links. Click Here To Register] 'the author of The Controversy of Zion: Jewish Nationalism, the Jewish State and the Unresolved Jewish Dilemma, which won an American National Jewish Book Award'.

But you could ask him: [Only Registered Users Can See Links. Click Here To Register]
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[Bartok]

Sounds to me as if he's trying to blame Irish republicanism for the Second World War, the intafada and 9/11. Really bizarre article.
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[Burbank Lilywhite]

Originally Posted by Dixie Chicken

Sounds to me as if he's trying to blame Irish republicanism for the Second World War, the intafada and 9/11. Really bizarre article.
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When everyone knows it was really the American capitilist pigs.
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[peels]

well said, the english goverment cause all these problems by trying to force their rule in other countries, (something they've done for centuries),then when these countries start to claim back what is rightfully theirs, they are branded trouble makers or even terrorists, but it's them who are the terrorists. they try to tell us that they civilise the poorer countries when all they're doing is raping them, which they tried to do to ireland and misserably failed as their so called british empire was brought to it's knees "BUT FOR 800 YEARS WE FOUGHT THEM WITHOUT FEAR , AND WE'LL FIGHT THEM FOR 800 MORE"

[HailHail]

Originally Posted by egb_hibs

Hard to believe that this ignorant, poisonous bullshit is from the guardian.

The evil legacy of the Easter Rising

For Ireland to celebrate the 80th anniversary of the 1916 rebellion is to betray democracy

Geoffrey Wheatcroft
Sunday April 9, 2006
The Observer

Last Tuesday, Denis Donaldson was found savagely murdered in County Donegal. Next weekend, the government of the Irish Republic will noisily celebrate the 90th anniversary of the Easter Rising. Perhaps only in Ireland could anyone fail to see the connection between the two.

Although it claimed to be a national rebellion, the rising was a very strange affair. The Irish Republican Brotherhood was a tiny sect with little popular following. In 1914, there had been deep sympathy in Ireland for Belgium as a small Catholic nation brutally violated, the official Nationalist party had supported the Great War and for every 'volunteer' who took part in the rising, there were 100 Irishmen fighting on the Western Front for home rule, which had already been granted by the London government.

As it turned out, the rebels lost their battle but won the 'narrative', to use an irritating but valid term. Sentiment was revolutionised by the executions which followed the rising, Sinn Fein swamped the constitutional party (just as it has recently done in Ulster), a free state was created in 1922 and it soon became what one Tory politician predicted at the time, the most reactionary corner of Europe.

Nor should that have been surprising. Although revisionist Irish historians have spent the past generation examining the creation of the state and its underlying myths, even the best of them tend towards insularity and have not noticed how Ireland fitted into a European pattern.

In the early decades of the 20th century, there was everywhere a reaction against constitutional liberalism into irrationalism, whether it was Mussolini's successful 'march on Rome' in 1922 or Hitler's unsuccessful Munich putsch of 1923.

The Easter Rising was the forerunner, echoed all too often thereafter. Patrick Pearse's exalted (or insane) words about the tired old earth that needed to be enriched by the spilling of much blood - that at a time when the blood of several million young men was being spilled on the Western Front - was the very language of Blut und Boden (blood and soil) that the National Socialists would soon use.



If the Irish want to celebrate the Easter Rising they may, but they must realise that they are in no moral position whatever to condemn any other violent insurrection against another lawful government carried out by people who feel strongly enough. Looking around the world today, the Easter rebels have a good deal to answer for."

Lawful feckin government
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He does make one decent point about it being a minority who started the rising. the equivalent of say the green party starting a rising here.
The rising was put down by mostly Irish Catholic soldiers too.

As for the rest of that "article", what a tit.

[HailHail]

Originally Posted by peels

well said, the english goverment cause all these problems by trying to force their rule in other countries, (something they've done for centuries),then when these countries start to claim back what is rightfully theirs, they are branded trouble makers or even terrorists, but it's them who are the terrorists. they try to tell us that they civilise the poorer countries when all they're doing is raping them, which they tried to do to ireland and misserably failed as their so called british empire was brought to it's knees "BUT FOR 800 YEARS WE FOUGHT THEM WITHOUT FEAR , AND WE'LL FIGHT THEM FOR 800 MORE"

Remember Britain won the war in Ireland ultimately, the only people who ever genuinely kicked the brits out were the U.S.A.

[Bartok]

Originally Posted by HailHail

Remember Britain won the war in Ireland ultimately, the only people who ever genuinely kicked the brits out were the U.S.A.

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:usa :usa :usa :usa :usa :usa :usa :usa :usa :usa :usa :usa :usa

UP THE REBELS

[snoots]

Originally Posted by HailHail

Remember Britain won the war in Ireland ultimately, the only people who ever genuinely kicked the brits out were the U.S.A.

..and argument could be made that that was actually the brits kicking the germans out of america...

[HailHail]

Originally Posted by snoots

..and argument could be made that that was actually the brits kicking the germans out of america...

Well there were a few thousand hessian german troops helping the redcoats against the continentals and george III'S grandfather was german so you could i suppose.

[egb_hibs]

Originally Posted by HailHail

Well there were a few thousand hessian german troops helping the redcoats against the continentals and george III'S grandfather was german so you could i suppose.

But wasn't it in large part actually the french that kicked those germans out?

feck i dinnae think there were any yanks or brits involved at all
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[HailHail]

Originally Posted by egb_hibs

But wasn't it in large part actually the french that kicked those germans out?

feck i dinnae think there were any yanks or brits involved at all
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It's interesting that this was the only colony from which britania inc was forcibly removed. the french sent thousands more troops to india but were unable to help the Indian princes kick the brits out.

The only reason I can think of sounds racist i.e europeans in america were perhaps more politically enlightened and adapted to modern warfare quicker than indigenous peoples of britains other colonies did. what do you think?

[snoots]

A lot of the Americans sort of still considered themselves British - they refused to renounce their loyalty to the King saying their argument was with the Govt.

To their mind they were fighting fior the right to pay taxes whilst gaining representation in the British Govt. That changed to a fight for independence later in the conflict.

There's also the theory that a lot British troops, the upper echalons included wanted the Yankees to win.

[egb_hibs]

Originally Posted by HailHail

It's interes