Evangelical Christians - Comedy kings.

[TonySoprano]

Guy on Channel 4 just now, accusing Jerry Springer the Opera of being blasphemous, and then says God is going to find these things blasphemous.

Now, it may not be blasphemous, but surely telling the world what God is thinking must be a bit dodgy in Christian circles?

[hibadelic]

Originally Posted by TonySoprano

Guy on Channel 4 just now, accusing Jerry Springer the Opera of being blasphemous, and then says God is going to find these things blasphemous.

Now, it may not be blasphemous, but surely telling the world what God is thinking must be a bit dodgy in Christian circles?

It always amazes me that someone as all powerful as god should be such a sensitive wee dude. Why does (s)he need to enlist the support of these twats, can't (s)he fight his/her own battles?
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[arthurduncan]

Originally Posted by hibadelic

It always amazes me that someone as all powerful as god should be such a sensitive wee dude. Why does (s)he need to enlist the support of these twats, can't (s)he fight his/her own battles?
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This is a classic problem from the philosophy of religion - God is supposed to possess all qualities to perfection (to an infinite degree), this is to help prove he is infinitely good. However how do you avoid him having all the other possible properties to an infinite degree including the less desirable ones? - so philosophers have tried for centuries to come up with a way of proving god is good (and not, say, evil) without just assuming what they are trying to prove - any argument that assumes god is good as a premise that leads to the conclusion god is good is circular. As you might expect, they failed. If he does possess each property infinitely as he would to be infinitely good, then unfortunately he also has to be infinitely vain, proud, obnoxious, sensitive etc. - hence why we really need to be nice to him - he's a mixed up dude.

[Greenmachine]

Thought the programme was awful TBH. One-sided in it's views, and the guy presenting it had a sneering, condescending manner towards the whole idea of creationism and the whole reason why christianity exists and flourishes in many parts of the world. He also, as per usual with people with a set agenda against christianity, displayed a tremendous ignorance and lack of knowledge about the subject matter.

Having said all that, the numptys he talked to probably did more to convert people to atheism than anybody could. There is certainly a place for Evangelical Christianity in the world today, I just can't be bothered by it's in-your -face style. The evangelical christians he spoke to came across as wide-eyed idealists rather than people with a genuine deep and true christian faith.

[egb_hibs]

Originally Posted by Greenmachine

Thought the programme was awful TBH. One-sided in it's views, and the guy presenting it had a sneering, condescending manner towards the whole idea of creationism and the whole reason why christianity exists and flourishes in many parts of the world. He also, as per usual with people with a set agenda against christianity, displayed a tremendous ignorance and lack of knowledge about the subject matter.

If I'm not mistaken, Rod Liddle is, in fact, a practicising anglican.

[gun ainm]

Originally Posted by arthurduncan

This is a classic problem from the philosophy of religion - God is supposed to possess all qualities to perfection (to an infinite degree), this is to help prove he is infinitely good. However how do you avoid him having all the other possible properties to an infinite degree including the less desirable ones? - so philosophers have tried for centuries to come up with a way of proving god is good (and not, say, evil) without just assuming what they are trying to prove - any argument that assumes god is good as a premise that leads to the conclusion god is good is circular. As you might expect, they failed. If he does possess each property infinitely as he would to be infinitely good, then unfortunately he also has to be infinitely vain, proud, obnoxious, sensitive etc. - hence why we really need to be nice to him - he's a mixed up dude.

reminds me of this beauty from Douglas Adams

I refuse to prove that I exist," says God, "for proof denies faith, and without faith I am nothing."

"But," says Man, "the Babel fish is a dead giveaway isn't it? It could not have evolved by chance. It proves you exist, and so therefore, by your own arguments, you don't. QED."

"Oh dear," says God, "I hadn't thought of that," and promptly vanishes in a puff of logic.


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[Brian]

Originally Posted by theselkie

reminds me of this beauty from Douglas Adams

"Oh dear," says God, "I hadn't thought of that," and promptly vanishes in a puff of logic.

Man goes on to prove that black is white and gets himself killed on the next zebra crossing.

[egb_hibs]

Brian and Selkie have, I think, just outed themselves as uber-geeks
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[snoots]

Originally Posted by Greenmachine

Thought the programme was awful TBH. One-sided in it's views, and the guy presenting it had a sneering, condescending manner towards the whole idea of creationism and the whole reason why christianity exists and flourishes in many parts of the world. He also, as per usual with people with a set agenda against christianity, displayed a tremendous ignorance and lack of knowledge about the subject matter.

Having said all that, the numptys he talked to probably did more to convert people to atheism than anybody could. There is certainly a place for Evangelical Christianity in the world today, I just can't be bothered by it's in-your -face style. The evangelical christians he spoke to came across as wide-eyed idealists rather than people with a genuine deep and true christian faith.

I agree there is a place for Evangelical Christianity in the world today, it's in Evangelical Christian homes and schools, not IMHO in state schools. If a state school was teaching Grimm's Fairy Tales as fact the head would be sacked in a minute.

For what it's worth I reckon the presenter had sneering, condescending manner towards the whole idea of creationism being taught in state schools, his grasp on the subject matter appeared pretty sound.

[Hampden_Hibby]

Originally Posted by TonySoprano

Guy on Channel 4 just now, accusing Jerry Springer the Opera of being blasphemous, and then says God is going to find these things blasphemous.

Now, it may not be blasphemous, but surely telling the world what God is thinking must be a bit dodgy in Christian circles?

If he's an evangelical christian then he's probably also a raging pervert who batters his missus and sleeps with the dug. They are not that fucked up in the head for no reason.

[egb_hibs]

Originally Posted by Hampden_Hibby

If he's an evangelical christian then he's probably also a raging pervert who batters his missus and sleeps with the dug. They are not that fucked up in the head for no reason.

I think you've taken that too far. Groundless demonisation there IMHO. On this basis, I shudder to think how you might describe other minority groups.

[Hampden_Hibby]

Originally Posted by egb_hibs

I think you've taken that too far. Groundless demonisation there IMHO. On this basis, I shudder to think how you might describe other minority groups.

No problem at all with other minority groups. Unless they're a minority group with a particularly narrow, intolerant, fanatic, dogmatic and unhealthy outlook on the wee vagaries of life. Which for me, says more about them and the scars they carry, than the wee vagaries of life.

Would it also be groundless demonisation for me to say that nuns have a shocking record in bringing up kids?

[gun ainm]

Originally Posted by DaddyK and his wee pal

I always had a sneaking suspicion, but there you are, prove positive
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douglas adams geeky? nah HHGTTG was uber cool, you just wouldnt know cool if it came up and slapped you in the pus with a wet fish
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[egb_hibs]

Originally Posted by Hampden_Hibby

No problem at all with other minority groups. Unless they're a minority group with a particularly narrow, intolerant, fanatic, dogmatic and unhealthy outlook on the wee vagaries of life. Which for me, says more about them and the scars they carry, than the wee vagaries of life.

Would it also be groundless demonisation for me to say that nuns have a shocking record in bringing up kids?

it's impossible to say for sure, without empirical data, but my personal suspicion is that nuns probably have no better or worse a record than school teachers of the period, especially in residential schools. i think that the latter doesn't generate the same headlines though.

as for evangelicals, while they're not my cup of tea, they have a respectable record in english history, in for example, championing the emancipation of slaves and the working class, while the established church and indeed large sections of the contemporary secular liberal elite were wont to exhibit a 'particularly narrow, intolerant, fanatic, dogmatic and unhealthy outlook on the wee vagaries of life.'

[egb_hibs]

Originally Posted by theselkie

douglas adams geeky? nah HHGTTG was uber cool, you just wouldnt know cool if it came up and slapped you in the pus with a wet fish
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douglas adams is the apostle of geekolicism.

[Brian]

Originally Posted by egb_hibs

douglas adams is the apostle of geekolicism.

Somebody struggling with their inner geek there, egb ?
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What was the 43 thing btw ? Did you ever tell us ?

[wee 162]

Originally Posted by Brian

Somebody struggling with their inner geek there, egb ?
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What was the 43 thing btw ? Did you ever tell us ?

He did. But he thought he might have made a total canute of it (could have been just to disguise his geekiness right enough!)
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[Hampden_Hibby]

Originally Posted by egb_hibs

it's impossible to say for sure, without empirical data, but my personal suspicion is that nuns probably have no better or worse a record than school teachers of the period, especially in residential schools. i think that the latter doesn't generate the same headlines though.

Of the period? I was referring to 20th century and I'm not convinced that it still isn't going on today. Trouble is we'll need to wait another 40 or 50 years until the kids of today speak up.

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[egb_hibs]

Originally Posted by Hampden_Hibby

Of the period? I was referring to 20th century and I'm not convinced that it still isn't going on today. Trouble is we'll need to wait another 40 or 50 years until the kids of today speak up.

I was also talking about the 20th century, though I suspect the earlier portion of that was subject to less transparency in all areas of society, with higher levels of insitutional abuse as a result.

As for your quotes, nobody is disputing your point. that said I am at a loss as to explain it's connection to evangelicals and would caution that rolling the things together, in the absence of an established connection, along with strange statements about evangelicals being perverted wife beaters, can create the impression of a blind prejudice, which I'm sure you are not afflicted with.

further, if you think the same sort of abuse did not / does not occur in care homes, boarding schools and just plain old schools, then - having eliminated blind prejudice - this demonstrates nothing so much as the power of the media or a selective reading of such.

[egb_hibs]

Originally Posted by Brian

Somebody struggling with their inner geek there, egb ?
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What was the 43 thing btw ? Did you ever tell us ?

I did - surprised you've forgotten that, since it led to you providing an intro to hex.

but i didn't get that 43 thing from HHGG - I got it from slashdot.

which isn't geeky in the slightest
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